Self/Automatic billing

[Mustang]

This happened to me (mid contract change). I wrote to them and said that I appreciated why they were doing it but didn't want them enfocing their procedures on me! The agent accepted the point I was making.

What we did was they still 'self-invoiced' and I still generated an invoice and sent it to them - I assume they just ignored/binned mine. When I got theirs I checked it for errors against mine.

[ASB]

How does it change the implied contract?

[Pedant] I didn't say it did, merely that it could be argued it does [/Pedant]

Anyway, invoicing methods are part of the overall arrangments. As such they are judged as part of the implied contract.

In the case of the OP they are being switched to self billing. This is a change and thus does change the implied contract.

[interested]

The system should be sending you an invoice, and it must have the words "THE VAT SHOWN IS YOUR OUTPUT TAX DUE TO CUSTOMS & EXCISE" on it

If the self biller (ie the agency) doesn't have this on their invoices, and you are VAT registered, they are breaking the law. I'm not quite so sure what the position is if you aren't VAT registered. Best check HMRC website for details

[Ardesco]

I'm neutral on the subject, except that the two self-billing systems I have used have both screwed up my VAT. May not be a problem for FRS people, but if you're doing it the traditional way it could get expensive.

Must admit that I check the VAT carefully (After all it's not my money and I don't want to have to top it up with my money), but i've had not problems so far.

(Yes i'm on a self billing system for this gig)

True, but I guess one could argue it does change the implied contract, which is what is judged - still can't see it making a jot of difference to overall status though.

How does it change the implied contract? You are still doing the same job with the same T & C's The only difference is that some swanky overpriced peice of software that the agent paid for is multiplying your rate * hours/days worked and coming up with a figure (Which you undoubtably check anyway to make sure it's correct). Doesn't really change how you work does it?

[ElectricChair]

Ive used it for a while - no issues

[malvolio]

I'm neutral on the subject, except that the two self-billing systems I have used have both screwed up my VAT. May not be a problem for FRS people, but if you're doing it the traditional way it could get expensive.

[simes]

Never had a problem with it.

Alexman use it and it seems to be fine.

I do have my own invoices made up though and these are kept for audit purposes. No one has to know whether you've been self billed or not.

[ASB]

Not to mention self billing does not change the terms of your contract, or your work situation.

True, but I guess one could argue it does change the implied contract, which is what is judged - still can't see it making a jot of difference to overall status though.

[Ardesco]

There have been suggestions self billing may be viewed as an IR35 pointer (but I personally doubt it)

Amazing what some people will try to class as an IR35 pointer. Lots of companies use self billing so if you are on it, it means nothing.

Not to mention self billing does not change the terms of your contract, or your work situation.

[ASB]

You cannot be forced to use a self billing scheme. However it can be a condition of supply (which amounts to forcing you anyway ). What this doers mean is this cannot be forced on you mid contract unless you are prepared to accept it, because it is a contractural change.

There is quite a lot of info on the HMRC website which may help put your mind at rest (or not). There have been suggestions self billing may be viewed as an IR35 pointer (but I personally doubt it)

[gingerjedi]

I/my Co. have never been paid any other, way in my case a fill in each day as '1' rather than hours worked, the timesheet only refers days worked and has no mention of rate or pay, I'm surprised an agency would introduce a sheet that does.

They also send a hard copy and an emailed copy of the actual invoice every week.

[kirk]

They should create an invoice for your company as well. You need an invoice for the audit trail (as do they).

I would suggest printing out your own invoices and keeping copies for your own records anyway. Useful if needed at a later date.

Exactly what I do

[Ardesco]

They should create an invoice for your company as well. You need an invoice for the audit trail (as do they).

I would suggest printing out your own invoices and keeping copies for your own records anyway. Useful if needed at a later date.

[Mr_Z]

My "agency" has just introduced this.
Contractor fills online timesheets in monthly, client signs and the company gets paid without invoicing.

I have a few concerns with the fact that after entering my hours (even though i get paid by the day) the timesheet application tot's up an amount that it refers to as my "weekly pay" - it's not, it's a B2B fee paid to my company. My "pay" is decided by the company.

Has anyone any experience with this or views? Do any of these issues or the fact that the company doesn't raise an invoice have any bearing on potential for IR35/deemed employment?