Reply to: Recommended solicitor for contract review

[northernladuk]

From speaking with them again this morning it seems a firm NO. Agency B whom the new contract is with are basically telling me that Agency A dont have much hope as its refusing me the right to work based on the supplier agreements.

So if Agency B are happy to shoulder any fall out and the client is willing to look the other way while you all dook it out then I must say I'd be tempted to start with agent B. As I say, I believe the handcuff will probably fail in court as there is no loss to prove, and I think agency A probably know this and it will cost them to get it there as well. The bigger danger was Agency B or client folding to the threats from Agent A. If it looks like they won't then tell agency A you'll see them in court and start the gig.

Maybe get a solicitor to write a letter pointing out there is no case due to no loss and carry on. Won't cost much for a letter.

At the very worst if you do lose the payment to Agency A will be less than you you being on the bench for 3 months, or more when the gig evaporates.

Thank-you for taking time to reply....i was thinking of sitting on the bench for a month or so then going back in after the dust has settled.

Why would you do this? Why not go get another gig? It's highly unlikely the gig will still be available in 3 months time.

[lancred]

First question is why does the client have gigs that the agent isn't handling? Is it a large corp with different agents? It's uncommon for a client to have an agent AND take people on direct. Would make much more sense to put it all though the incumbent supplier and these issues would not occur. Can they not just bat it through the agent like I expect it should be?

Yes its a bank. So im sure youre aware that they deal with multiple agencies. Another large IT company took on part of one side of the IT, and the bank retained the other side. So Dept. A is via Agency A, Dept. B is via Agency B. Agency A dont have a supplier agreement to provide Dept. B and vice versa. Im going from A to B and via the separate agencies. I asked if Agency A could obtain the contract for Dept. B but they said they dont have the supplier agreement and it would take a while (probs longer than 3 mnths to setup)

As ever though, the best way around this is negotiation. The agent won't really want to piss their client off for the sake of one person as well as the fact they aren't really losing anything. They could negotiate a small payment to release you and everyone is happy but that is between the client and the agent. You are along for the ride really.

Yes ive asked to see if there is any room from the account manager at my current agency, but again this was denied.

Is the agency aware of the situation? If so you could just give them a bell and suggest they won't be losing anything and it's a one off, could they work with the client and everyone comes out happy? I wouldn't be too threatening or mention breach, try and work with them. Suggest the client does the same but I would expect this is dealt with by someone else rather than your direct client contacts.

Apart from that there isn't much else you can do except hope the client/agent can reach an agreement or that the client is willing to strong arm the agent in to allowing this and off you go.

Taking legal action will be very expensive and is likely to end up you getting binned off rather than helping your cause. Try and sort it out well before that.

From speaking with them again this morning it seems a firm NO. Agency B whom the new contract is with are basically telling me that Agency A dont have much hope as its refusing me the right to work based on the supplier agreements.

Thank-you for taking time to reply....i was thinking of sitting on the bench for a month or so then going back in after the dust has settled.

[northernladuk]

So i had the contract reviewed via Vantage (QDOS Recommendation) and the clauses in the contract are worded that I cant go back and work for the client within a three month period. This was based on the fact myself giving notice to end the contract or refuse a renewal if offered.

Quite normal and fairly refreshing that it's 3 months and not something stupid like 12.

I have since spoken to my line manager

He's not your line manager. If your contract is marginally outside you need to be a bit more belt and braces around things like this <pedant mode off>

I have since spoken to my line manager his line manager and one above are all are in agreement and happy with the situation that I can in effect finish on a Friday and start Monday and start work in another separate part of the business.

But you have no contractual relationship with these people so slightly irrelevant.

All these people are perms for my current end client. So it was agreed to let the assignment come to a natural end on the last day (a renewal isn't to be offered).....tho this is still yet to be confirmed by the agency (id have assumed a letter or email would have come by now). However in the meantime, my line manager has since come back to me and said its been mentioned that I need to wait three months before I can start back again.

As per the contractual agreement you have.

the new contract is in a different part of the business and my current agency dont have the supplier agreement to take on the contract themseleves (it would have been easier!!) so is there any room that if I start the new contract they could still persue me for breach? Im trying to think on the lines of a a refusal of right to work?

First question is why does the client have gigs that the agent isn't handling? Is it a large corp with different agents? It's uncommon for a client to have an agent AND take people on direct. Would make much more sense to put it all though the incumbent supplier and these issues would not occur. Can they not just bat it through the agent like I expect it should be?

But anyway.. So yes the agent can pursue you for breach. If they have an agreement with the client that they are the sole supplier of contracting staff they'll be wanting to have words with the client as they are in breach of their overarching agreement as well.

That aside, technically, if the agent cannot demonstrate loss then the complaint of breach won't stand BUT they can do it anyway because of the previous paragraph and because they are all bum holes. They may also want to take a stand to stop the client doing this in future. The case may not stand but the agent can make enough of a fuss that the client drops you and no one wins. Very frustrating and unfair but not unheard of.

As ever though, the best way around this is negotiation. The agent won't really want to piss their client off for the sake of one person as well as the fact they aren't really losing anything. They could negotiate a small payment to release you and everyone is happy but that is between the client and the agent. You are along for the ride really.

Is the agency aware of the situation? If so you could just give them a bell and suggest they won't be losing anything and it's a one off, could they work with the client and everyone comes out happy? I wouldn't be too threatening or mention breach, try and work with them. Suggest the client does the same but I would expect this is dealt with by someone else rather than your direct client contacts.

Apart from that there isn't much else you can do except hope the client/agent can reach an agreement or that the client is willing to strong arm the agent in to allowing this and off you go.

Taking legal action will be very expensive and is likely to end up you getting binned off rather than helping your cause. Try and sort it out well before that.

[GhostofTarbera]

Lots of companies have a 3/6 month rule about contractors when the leave, they will probably just find someone else


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[lancred]

So i had the contract reviewed via Vantage (QDOS Recommendation) and the clauses in the contract are worded that I cant go back and work for the client within a three month period. This was based on the fact myself giving notice to end the contract or refuse a renewal if offered.

I have since spoken to my line manager, his line manager and one above are all are in agreement and happy with the situation that I can in effect finish on a Friday and start Monday and start work in another separate part of the business. All these people are perms for my current end client. So it was agreed to let the assignment come to a natural end on the last day (a renewal isn't to be offered).....tho this is still yet to be confirmed by the agency (id have assumed a letter or email would have come by now). However in the meantime, my line manager has since come back to me and said its been mentioned that I need to wait three months before I can start back again.

the new contract is in a different part of the business and my current agency dont have the supplier agreement to take on the contract themseleves (it would have been easier!!) so is there any room that if I start the new contract they could still persue me for breach? Im trying to think on the lines of a a refusal of right to work?

[GhostofTarbera]

Recommended solicitor for contract review

Maybe I should add the fact that the newer role that im hoping to take up isn't offered by my current agency so there is no direct competition, therefore they aren't loosing out on the money. been checking up on the 'handshake' threads and seems that I may be ok to take the role based on this.

And your current client boss is happy for you to jump ship to new role and leave him in the lurch?

If so go for it


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[Jess inniAccounts]

The Law Place are experts in this field

[lancred]

Maybe I should add the fact that the newer role that im hoping to take up isn't offered by my current agency so there is no direct competition, therefore they aren't loosing out on the money. been checking up on the 'handshake' threads and seems that I may be ok to take the role based on this.

[GhostofTarbera]

thanks all for the replies and comments. its not related to IR35, more to the termination clauses in the current contract and working back at the client, but via a different agency. QDOS recommended Vantage, but I will called AbbeyTax aswell for a chat to see what their services are.

Luckily this same situation has only happened hundreds of times on these forums before


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[lancred]

thanks all for the replies and comments. its not related to IR35, more to the termination clauses in the current contract and working back at the client, but via a different agency. QDOS recommended Vantage, but I will called AbbeyTax aswell for a chat to see what their services are.

[malvolio]

I would suggest accepting QDOS's recommentation, since they have done a number of detailed reviews for me in the past. Money well worth it.

If you are an IPSE Member, they have a legal helpline, too?

They do, but won't be able to comment or advise on specific contracts, only general points of law and similar which is to do with the definition of qualified advice.

Hence I suggested AbbeyTax, who can obviously deal with specific contracts and will review the whole thing, not just the IR35-related bits. Not sure it's the cheapest option though!

[Scruff]

I would suggest accepting QDOS's recommentation, since they have done a number of detailed reviews for me in the past. Money well worth it.

If you are an IPSE Member, they have a legal helpline, too?

[JohntheBike]

Try AbbeyTax...

yes, they did a comprehensive assessment of my contract, which although different in detail to two previous contracts, arrived at the same assessment as the previous contracts, in that I'm marginally outside IR35.

[lancred]

Sounds like s good quote to me, if recommended by qdos whats the problem ?

Anything cheaper I would find suspicious


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There is no problem. Just asking if anyone has used a firm in the past that they would recommend so I could obtain a quote from.

[GhostofTarbera]

Hi All.

Im looking for any recommendations for a contract review in terms of specific clauses relating to termination and rejoining the client via a different agency. Ive been quoted £195 + VAT for a review, but was wondering if there are any other companies that have been used. This was a quote via Vantage Legal who were recommended by QDOS.

Any recommendations appreciated. Thanks

Sounds like s good quote to me, if recommended by qdos whats the problem ?

Anything cheaper I would find suspicious


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