Public sector contracting

[centurian]

Have we done this yet?

'Off-payroll worker rules to hinge on IR35 business test' :: Contractor UK

But crucially, and with all four of the above positions, if the end-user - a public body or government department, “is not satisfied with the evidence they receive [from the worker they have engaged] they may send [the worker’s/individual’s] details” to HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC).

Also of interest

But problematically, the mainstream press is a no-go area. “[We’ve] spoken to… the Financial Times, the Daily Mail and the Daily Telegraph. They are not prepared to attack the government on bringing in these measures”, PCG regretted. “They would be more interested if we could show the consequences would harm the delivery of public services but they want hard evidence and case studies”.

Like I said in the previous post - simple maths - for every one of us, there are 20+ people that want the government to come down like a ton of bricks.

[bobspud]

So the interesting development for today is that several agencies have already started to cold call as many of the guys in our client that they can find. From the looks of it the other agencies are trying to find a list of as many contractors as possible to replace the freelance guys that are leaving the other departments that they supply...

I had a few quiet discussions over the course of the day to figure out how many of my delivery team will still be available come renewal and the answer is zero.

It has also turned out that the IT manager on site had no grasp of what has just happened to his team, and has been sitting in meetings telling his boss that he will only lose two or three guys at most! So one of the BA's took him to one side and showed him the truth over a coffee and he was not very happy when they came back.

[BolshieBastard]

While that may be an objective - they will need a different weapon to achieve this. With the public sector, they can simply issue an edict telling departments not to hire contractors on a tax-avoidance friendly basis - which is pretty much what they have done.

They can't instruct the private sector to do this - they would have to pass a law, which may well be the final step.

Of course they would have to pass a law to do this in the private sector. Even if my post didnt specifically say this, I think it's pretty obvious.

Besides, they are part way there already, look at IR35 which is, incidentally, being beefed up with more compliance officers.

[Old Greg]

So the interesting development for today is that several agencies have already started to cold call as many of the guys in our client that they can find. From the looks of it the other agencies are trying to find a list of as many contractors as possible to replace the freelance guys that are leaving the other departments that they supply...

I had a few quiet discussions over the course of the day to figure out how many of my delivery team will still be available come renewal and the answer is zero.

It has also turned out that the IT manager on site had no grasp of what has just happened to his team, and has been sitting in meetings telling his boss that he will only lose two or three guys at most! So one of the BA's took him to one side and showed him the truth over a coffee and he was not very happy when they came back.

No word yet from my large agency.

Maybe we need to set up a contract swap shop so we can move about every 6 months.

[centurian]

Of course they would have to pass a law to do this in the private sector. Even if my post didnt specifically say this, I think it's pretty obvious.

Besides, they are part way there already, look at IR35 which is, incidentally, being beefed up with more compliance officers.

Passing a new law is a lot harder than just sending out a memo though.

However, in the current climate, it probably wouldn't be too hard.

[BolshieBastard]

Passing a new law is a lot harder than just sending out a memo though.

However, in the current climate, it probably wouldn't be too hard.

Indeed it is but given the current 'fair share of tax' and PSC climate, I wouldnt rule it out. Would you?

[bobspud]

Passing a new law is a lot harder than just sending out a memo though.

However, in the current climate, it probably wouldn't be too hard.

Thats what they tried to do for IR35... still the fact remain that IR35 works fine as it is and most contractors are more than able to work _WITH_ the law to ensure they pay their fair share of tax...

[moggy]

Passing a new law is a lot harder than just sending out a memo though.

However, in the current climate, it probably wouldn't be too hard.

Couldn't they just introduce the dept transfer for agencies/clients thats found to be paying ltd comps that are inside ir35 and acting as if outside? that would in effect have a similar effect as the public sector memo.

[BlueShoot]

This has got the dept that I'm contracting into in a real spin. The response from the few remaining contractors has been 'p*ss off we're not signing up to that' and the support from central govt for their own team has been zero.

At the moment, they're seeking guidance from the parent co. who have pushed them back to Cabinet Office. The CO will no doubt push it back to Treasury and hopefully this may then go away. At the moment what advice their is seems to be that this applies to a Ltd co. directly brought in by and invoicing to the govt dept. and to weed out anymore 'head of the student loan co.' mickey takers. If this is the case, it's possible that it will not apply to agencies on the OGC frameworks who use ltd co. resources to provide services. Who knows if this is correct today, tomorrow or next week though - this is the govt!

What I do know is that there are a few small teams of civil servants whose depts have been cut to the bone now having a load more work dropped on them and they're really not happy at all!

[BolshieBastard]

This has got the dept that I'm contracting into in a real spin. The response from the few remaining contractors has been 'p*ss off we're not signing up to that' and the support from central govt for their own team has been zero.

At the moment, they're seeking guidance from the parent co. who have pushed them back to Cabinet Office. The CO will no doubt push it back to Treasury and hopefully this may then go away. At the moment what advice their is seems to be that this applies to a Ltd co. directly brought in by and invoicing to the govt dept. and to weed out anymore 'head of the student loan co.' mickey takers. If this is the case, it's possible that it will not apply to agencies on the OGC frameworks who use ltd co. resources to provide services. Who knows if this is correct today, tomorrow or next week though - this is the govt!

What I do know is that there are a few small teams of civil servants whose depts have been cut to the bone now having a load more work dropped on them and they're really not happy at all!

I just cant see that happening because you'd have one set of PSC's being treated as inside IR35 after 6 months and others, because they are contracted to a big co like HP but still working on Gov projects, effectively being exempted from the same regulations.

I know governments are thick but they're not that thick. they'll want everyone caught that fits their model.