I've spent days reading articles and other forums and I haven't found answers to my questions. If it so happens that I was being dim and missed something I apologise in advance and would appreciate a gentle nudge in the right direction.
With that out of the way, I'l try and be concise while giving as many details as possible for informed feedback on this.
I started my current contract in October 2019 (one year and got extended till September 2021 due to project requirements ). The site I currently visit the most will close in Sept 21 and the contract would most likely become nonviable for my Ltd after that, even outside IR35 - so no intention to go further than Sept 2021 anyway). The contract is through an agency.
The contract is clearly worded to be outside IR35 and in practice this is also the case. I'm an engineering consultant working for my own consultancy. I do my work how I deem it best to be done (but do consider costumer's opinions into consideration obviously - I don't contractually have to as I am ultimately liable for any shortcomings), there is a right of substitution which was never needed to be used (the customer can refuse the sub if they can prove the sub is not qualified which is normal B2B), my LTD had to supply own safety equipment, my LTD is liable for damage and expenses in the event of mistakes etc... I will conceded that I was forced to use a laptop provided by the customer and certain other SW tools but this is purely to do with the IT infrastructure they have in place at the customer's end, and the bespoke nature of the systems I am helping them deliver: overall the project is massive and I assist with a small aspect of its delivery as the work is very specialised. I'd rather use my own equipment if I can.
Now, the end client has deemed the contract to be inside IR35. In reality this is a blanket ban on independent contractors, but they are masking it as an individual SDS (they have even tried to draw comparisons between the work I do and other contractors who work as technicians doing routine tasks etc...).
Here starts the messy bit:
The client used the CEST, with the wrong information.
1. The customer reps say that they would not accept a substitute, essentially out of principle and without justification (their 'reason' is that they feel they would incur additional overheads, my response: that's not what we've agreed to).
2. They claim I follow their company work instructions: Never even seen one, other than basic H&S stuff and that sort of thing, in fact if anything I have written (unofficial) instructions to help them stay out of my way so I can do my work.
3. They claim the expenses incurred are not substantial. HMRC do not actually seem to set a limit to costs incurred, and I provide my own PPE etc...and don't get given anything other than the aforementioned crappy laptop with some SW on it which is only lent to me to be able to connect to their network and work on their systems, get project communications etc... this is purely to do with their IT infrastructure.
4. That I have fixed working hours and fixed place of work (categorically untrue, I just tend to visit the same sight during the same times but there was never any official agreement for this - its just the easiest way to get stuff done)
The list goes on.
Turns out the Agency seems to have had different agreements with the two parties... so it would appear that even though the contract I signed and was working to was outside IR35, the agreement between the agency and the customer could very well have been different all along, unbeknown to me!
Anyway, the customer is being unbelievably pig-headed about this and the agent is being utterly useless, and generally untrustworthy (see previous sentence).
Now I am pretty much being told I either go umbrella, or stay deemed LTD (but get a reduced rate!). I half heatedly accepted to go umbrella until I find another contract, but haven't actually signed anything yet.
I have read a draft of the new (umbrella) contract and it does seem to be worded differently.
Nevertheless I'm nervous as, although I have nothing to hide, I really don't have the resources to deal with any potential investigation and make a living at the same time. Also I do't believe HMRC and don't trust their competence or their statements when they say they won't investigate without reason to suspect wrong doing (what does that even mean!?)
Given that I was planning to leave in September any way I am starting to wonder whether it is worth me walking away now, but the market is still week because of the whole COVID thing.
Also the most annoying thing in all this is the fact there does not seem to be an independent authority to give a final verdict. Is there?
The very fact that the contract is being changes kind of proves the initial "outside" determination of the original contract.
Going forward I still intend to take the first outside opportunity I see so I can carry on building and growing my business, but this whole situation is quite surreal!
I would appreciate other peoples's opinion on this with perhaps some advice on how to proceed in the least controversial way possible.
With that out of the way, I'l try and be concise while giving as many details as possible for informed feedback on this.
I started my current contract in October 2019 (one year and got extended till September 2021 due to project requirements ). The site I currently visit the most will close in Sept 21 and the contract would most likely become nonviable for my Ltd after that, even outside IR35 - so no intention to go further than Sept 2021 anyway). The contract is through an agency.
The contract is clearly worded to be outside IR35 and in practice this is also the case. I'm an engineering consultant working for my own consultancy. I do my work how I deem it best to be done (but do consider costumer's opinions into consideration obviously - I don't contractually have to as I am ultimately liable for any shortcomings), there is a right of substitution which was never needed to be used (the customer can refuse the sub if they can prove the sub is not qualified which is normal B2B), my LTD had to supply own safety equipment, my LTD is liable for damage and expenses in the event of mistakes etc... I will conceded that I was forced to use a laptop provided by the customer and certain other SW tools but this is purely to do with the IT infrastructure they have in place at the customer's end, and the bespoke nature of the systems I am helping them deliver: overall the project is massive and I assist with a small aspect of its delivery as the work is very specialised. I'd rather use my own equipment if I can.
Now, the end client has deemed the contract to be inside IR35. In reality this is a blanket ban on independent contractors, but they are masking it as an individual SDS (they have even tried to draw comparisons between the work I do and other contractors who work as technicians doing routine tasks etc...).
Here starts the messy bit:
The client used the CEST, with the wrong information.
1. The customer reps say that they would not accept a substitute, essentially out of principle and without justification (their 'reason' is that they feel they would incur additional overheads, my response: that's not what we've agreed to).
2. They claim I follow their company work instructions: Never even seen one, other than basic H&S stuff and that sort of thing, in fact if anything I have written (unofficial) instructions to help them stay out of my way so I can do my work.
3. They claim the expenses incurred are not substantial. HMRC do not actually seem to set a limit to costs incurred, and I provide my own PPE etc...and don't get given anything other than the aforementioned crappy laptop with some SW on it which is only lent to me to be able to connect to their network and work on their systems, get project communications etc... this is purely to do with their IT infrastructure.
4. That I have fixed working hours and fixed place of work (categorically untrue, I just tend to visit the same sight during the same times but there was never any official agreement for this - its just the easiest way to get stuff done)
The list goes on.
Turns out the Agency seems to have had different agreements with the two parties... so it would appear that even though the contract I signed and was working to was outside IR35, the agreement between the agency and the customer could very well have been different all along, unbeknown to me!
Anyway, the customer is being unbelievably pig-headed about this and the agent is being utterly useless, and generally untrustworthy (see previous sentence).
Now I am pretty much being told I either go umbrella, or stay deemed LTD (but get a reduced rate!). I half heatedly accepted to go umbrella until I find another contract, but haven't actually signed anything yet.
I have read a draft of the new (umbrella) contract and it does seem to be worded differently.
Nevertheless I'm nervous as, although I have nothing to hide, I really don't have the resources to deal with any potential investigation and make a living at the same time. Also I do't believe HMRC and don't trust their competence or their statements when they say they won't investigate without reason to suspect wrong doing (what does that even mean!?)
Given that I was planning to leave in September any way I am starting to wonder whether it is worth me walking away now, but the market is still week because of the whole COVID thing.
Also the most annoying thing in all this is the fact there does not seem to be an independent authority to give a final verdict. Is there?
The very fact that the contract is being changes kind of proves the initial "outside" determination of the original contract.
Going forward I still intend to take the first outside opportunity I see so I can carry on building and growing my business, but this whole situation is quite surreal!
I would appreciate other peoples's opinion on this with perhaps some advice on how to proceed in the least controversial way possible.
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