HMRC Enquiry letters on Loans from EBT and other schemes

[BrilloPad]

WTT/Big Group are the only game in town. Highly recommended.

At the moment they appear to face an uphill battle. Which is what was said about double taxation 2 years ago. TAA changed all that.....

[webberg]

Let's be fair, every strategy is looking at an uphill fight.

The litigation groups may get to Court in the next 12 months and get a final decision in perhaps 5 to 7 years.

Negotiation groups are unlikely to make progress until we persuade politicians that the policy they require HMRC to follow is flawed. Or until HMRC suffer a defeat in Court - see above.

The only certainly is that doing nothing puts you at the mercy of HMRC.

[9times5]

Hi Potsie

I paid for some advice 6 months back and it was useful, this was prior to the information on the new post.
Am happy to share the information.
Am I allowed to post my email address here ? If so u can then email me and I will send it on.

Murray

Hi Woftam, I just signed up just so I can PM you. I am a fellow Aussie in the same predicament and am curious to know legal considerations with the ATO. Will PM you as soon as I have PM'ing permission.

[creativity]

Well I'm voting Brexit.
It's a good opportunity to show my disgust over the way the Government have handled this.

[ozibattler31]

ozibattler31

Hi Woftam, I just signed up just so I can PM you. I am a fellow Aussie in the same predicament and am curious to know legal considerations with the ATO. Will PM you as soon as I have PM'ing permission.

Hi another Fellow Aussie here, my first post. Also got issues with HMRC.

w ww.dwyerlawyers.com.au/are-foreign-tax-grabs-a-possibility/ - Are Foreign Tax Grabs a Possibility? - Dwyer Lawyers Chartered Tax Advisers, Estate Planning, Tax Planning and Advice, Wills, Estates, Probate, Powers of Attorney, Tax, Trusts, Superannuation, Succession, Business Lawyers Australia
Is worth a read. Long held legal principle (India case circa 1953) was no enforcability of foreign tax debts.

However powers for ATO enforcement under
OECD convention came into effect re HMRC for 2012-13 tax year onwards, but has no retrospective powers as far as I can tell (No MOU signed), that however could change but seems unlikely now.
w ww.treasury.gov.au/Policy-Topics/Taxation/Tax-Treaties/HTML/Convention-on-MAA-in-Tax-Matters]Convention on Mutual Administrative Assistance in Tax Matters | The Treasury


It seems that:-
12-13 UK tax years onwards there is enforcement power in place via ATO under the convention, BUT APN's in my non lawyer opinion don't comply with the convention.

11-12 UK tax years and prior to me seems no powers in Oz.

HMRC recently threatened to hand over to ATO debt collection of an alleged debt under an APN which applies to tax year near on a decade old. Letter was short vague and completely lacked legislation references, i think they were bluffing. Called them on lack of powers, and not complying with convention even if powers exist, but did make a modest 'without prejudice' offer to try and close the matter out.

No response so far.

[woftam]

Hi another Fellow Aussie here, my first post. Also got issues with HMRC.

w ww.dwyerlawyers.com.au/are-foreign-tax-grabs-a-possibility/ - Are Foreign Tax Grabs a Possibility? - Dwyer Lawyers Chartered Tax Advisers, Estate Planning, Tax Planning and Advice, Wills, Estates, Probate, Powers of Attorney, Tax, Trusts, Superannuation, Succession, Business Lawyers Australia
Is worth a read. Long held legal principle (India case circa 1953) was no enforcability of foreign tax debts.

However powers for ATO enforcement under
OECD convention came into effect re HMRC for 2012-13 tax year onwards, but has no retrospective powers as far as I can tell (No MOU signed), that however could change but seems unlikely now.
w ww.treasury.gov.au/Policy-Topics/Taxation/Tax-Treaties/HTML/Convention-on-MAA-in-Tax-Matters]Convention on Mutual Administrative Assistance in Tax Matters | The Treasury


It seems that:-
12-13 UK tax years onwards there is enforcement power in place via ATO under the convention, BUT APN's in my non lawyer opinion don't comply with the convention.

11-12 UK tax years and prior to me seems no powers in Oz.

HMRC recently threatened to hand over to ATO debt collection of an alleged debt under an APN which applies to tax year near on a decade old. Letter was short vague and completely lacked legislation references, i think they were bluffing. Called them on lack of powers, and not complying with convention even if powers exist, but did make a modest 'without prejudice' offer to try and close the matter out.

No response so far.

Hi ozzibattler31

I paid for some advice from dwyerlawyers in September 2015 in which I received a report. Happy to share just PM me.
I have seen 2 of thos notices you mention from others in Australia and they are very ambiguous. It states they "May" come looking and also states the "relavent Authority". No mention of ATO or any of the legislation references as they so like to put in their correspondance.

[ozibattler31]

Hi Woftham

Hi ozzibattler31

I paid for some advice from dwyerlawyers in September 2015 in which I received a report. Happy to share just PM me.
I have seen 2 of thos notices you mention from others in Australia and they are very ambiguous. It states they "May" come looking and also states the "relavent Authority". No mention of ATO or any of the legislation references as they so like to put in their correspondance.

The key words you picked are the ones that stood out to me in the letter. Newbie how do i PM you?

[JamesBennett]

Hi all

I received a letter form HMRC back in 2010 saying they were looking into Kinsella, who I was working for for a few months. Then nothing. I left the UK, did my P85, was told I had nothing more I needed to do with HMRC unless things changed, moved around a lot more, lost/threw away any documentation around this (as it was such a long time and was told it was all settled).

Since then I moved back to the UK for a bit, and now living in New Zealand.

I got a letter from HMRC asking for more information, claiming to have sent a settlement offer in 2014 (which I did't get as I wasn't living at the address they had on file). I replied saying I did't get the settlement and had no documentation around the loan and couldn't remember the details.

They've now come back asking for more info. No demand for money yet.

My plan is to reply maintaining I don't remember the details, which is true. I have no wish to incriminate myself by making claims that could be false.

Does anyone have any tips? Can they come after me outside of the UK? I had a quick look at big group and Kinsella is not listed there, and I don't know if they cover me outside of the UK.

Honestly after a few moves I'm currently skint - no assets they could claim, no money to pay them back.

Would appreciate some advice.

Thanks!

[JK83]

Hi ozzibattler31

I paid for some advice from dwyerlawyers in September 2015 in which I received a report. Happy to share just PM me.
I have seen 2 of thos notices you mention from others in Australia and they are very ambiguous. It states they "May" come looking and also states the "relavent Authority". No mention of ATO or any of the legislation references as they so like to put in their correspondance.

Hi Woftam

Just wondering i you would be able to share with me as well? I am a complete newbie and also Australian too and have just received my APN notice from HMRC from the 10 months in which I used Cascade Management in 2010-2011.

I left the UK in March 2012 and filed my last tax return for the 2012/2013 year as well.

I have been living in NYC ever since and am in the process of moving back to Australia. The HMRC has been sending the correspondence to my UK address for the past 12 months so it has only been 2 weeks since I have been privy to this matter. They have also threatened to contact the local authorities in the States.

Because HMRC have contacted me so late, all of the support system set up by Cascade are all now no longer available to me and I am stumped as to what to do now.

You help wold be much appreciated.

Thanks!

[bandemelbs]

Hi Woftam

Just wondering i you would be able to share with me as well? I am a complete newbie and also Australian too and have just received my APN notice from HMRC from the 10 months in which I used Cascade Management in 2010-2011.

I left the UK in March 2012 and filed my last tax return for the 2012/2013 year as well.

I have been living in NYC ever since and am in the process of moving back to Australia. The HMRC has been sending the correspondence to my UK address for the past 12 months so it has only been 2 weeks since I have been privy to this matter. They have also threatened to contact the local authorities in the States.

Because HMRC have contacted me so late, all of the support system set up by Cascade are all now no longer available to me and I am stumped as to what to do now.

You help wold be much appreciated.

Thanks!

Send an email to [email protected] and feel free to PM me if you have any other questions, as there a few of us in a similar position to yourself.