Another Consulting Overseas Victim?

[Lewis]

Thanks all.

Have been doing some more research and it looks as though CO are working with a firm of lawyers, Chiltern, to fight HMRC and assist ex-employees. They have a private forum for ex-employees to log into where they have documented progress to date.

At the moment Chiltern have reached an impasse with HMRC (it does appear that HMRC have behaved quite slovenly over the whole thing which is now in its 3rd year. e.g. not responding to letters from Chiltern, not following up on actions, declaring that the FX broker used for the loans did not exist (they looked up a directory of banks instead of brokers!) etc...).

The next step is to put selected test cases in front of the Special Commissioners, estimated to happen by end of this year.

Chiltern appears confident that the scheme was valid based on the facts but I know that when it comes to these kinds of cases that can be irrelevant.

A few years back Chiltern also negotiated settlement terms for the first tranche of employees selected for investigation if they wanted to settle. I think the terms were basically 1. no penalty, 2. if Chiltern wins or HMRC drop the case everyone gets a refund. This looks ok I guess but I suppose the more who settle, the less likely it is that the case will win.

I'm unsure about whether Chiltern will also assist those covered in this latest wave of investigations. Will know on Monday hopefully.

Sounds like good news. At least you are not on your own!

[2uk]

Bert , you were involved in a certain scheme by some company. You are not accountant nor tax specialist.

If the HMRC has sent you a letter claiming tax - this would mean that the HMRC have already prosecuted CO and found that their scheme was illegal. If this is the case why don't you send a letter to the HMRC telling them that "before you pay anything , you will be claiming this amount from OC since they were the body that were operating the scheme and you were merely a customer.

Then ask HMRC to send you the details about the owners/new name of OC and sue them for involving you in a illegal scheme.

I know that these schemes involve loopholes in the law and are technically legal. If HMRC is questioning what CO were doing - then you take the side of HMRC and seek your money from CO.

[Bert]

Thanks all.

Have been doing some more research and it looks as though CO are working with a firm of lawyers, Chiltern, to fight HMRC and assist ex-employees. They have a private forum for ex-employees to log into where they have documented progress to date.

At the moment Chiltern have reached an impasse with HMRC (it does appear that HMRC have behaved quite slovenly over the whole thing which is now in its 3rd year. e.g. not responding to letters from Chiltern, not following up on actions, declaring that the FX broker used for the loans did not exist (they looked up a directory of banks instead of brokers!) etc...).

The next step is to put selected test cases in front of the Special Commissioners, estimated to happen by end of this year.

Chiltern appears confident that the scheme was valid based on the facts but I know that when it comes to these kinds of cases that can be irrelevant.

A few years back Chiltern also negotiated settlement terms for the first tranche of employees selected for investigation if they wanted to settle. I think the terms were basically 1. no penalty, 2. if Chiltern wins or HMRC drop the case everyone gets a refund. This looks ok I guess but I suppose the more who settle, the less likely it is that the case will win.

I'm unsure about whether Chiltern will also assist those covered in this latest wave of investigations. Will know on Monday hopefully.

[Bumfluff]

Thanks Lewis - no, I'm in Hong Kong, not Oz! Sounds like exactly the scheme I was on though.

Have contacted Accountax to see what they can do. Not sure how they operate though. Do I pay 500 quid for them to review my case and then tell me to "bend over" ... as someone put so eloquently above?

Also surprised that Consulting Overseas are being elusive. They sent me a letter a couple of years back warning that others had received letters and did seem to be planning to fight but I'm not sure whether they won, lost or just went bust.

I know HMRC operate on a "divide and conquer" basis so am really hoping for someone else who's been here and come out the other end.

Bert my mate used the same scheme with Consulting overseas they came after him a couple of years back, the case went to court but they lost due to a screw up by the tax inspector, may be they are having another go. Im still trying to get in touch with the guy for you and when I do I will PM you.

[ChimpMaster]

Shame how, 4 years later, when you might have even forgotten about this, HMRC pull out a blinder like that.

I guess they invesigated CO first, and then managed to obtain a list of all its contractors to target.

I remember back then that there were a number of firms providing the loan/fx scheme, but it seems like they all disappeared quite rapidly.

Good luck - do let us know how you get on.

[Bert]

Thanks Lewis - no, I'm in Hong Kong, not Oz! Sounds like exactly the scheme I was on though.

Have contacted Accountax to see what they can do. Not sure how they operate though. Do I pay 500 quid for them to review my case and then tell me to "bend over" ... as someone put so eloquently above?

Also surprised that Consulting Overseas are being elusive. They sent me a letter a couple of years back warning that others had received letters and did seem to be planning to fight but I'm not sure whether they won, lost or just went bust.

I know HMRC operate on a "divide and conquer" basis so am really hoping for someone else who's been here and come out the other end.

[Lewis]

How did this scheme operate?

Is it the loan scheme where they supposedly loan you money and then never pay it back, and then take massive fees to cover it?

Are others still operating the same thing that they used to?

The one I am aware of involved being loaned money in a foreign currency and the purchase of an FX forward to pay off the loan in a year or so. The currency would be rapidly devaluing, e.g. ZWD. The FX forward would be cheap. Meaning contractor has almost all the money guaranteed there are then (not sure what they did with interest, maybe that was also factored into FX Forward). It had a very high return (>85% I think). I know an ex-collegue on it who got challenged but had moved to Oz. Bert, you're not my old collegue are you?

I'm surprised CO are doing nothing. Last I heard a few years back from collegue was that CO were advising everyone to stick together so I assumed they were planning to defend the scheme. They did have all the tax council stuff saying it was ok I think. Just goes to show with these schemes, they are happy to take your money but won't help when the sh*t hits the fan!

[dude69]

How did this scheme operate?

Is it the loan scheme where they supposedly loan you money and then never pay it back, and then take massive fees to cover it?

Are others still operating the same thing that they used to?

[Bert]

thanks

The current OC website is dud. I'm sure the same individuals have just renamed and setup under a different name.

I was on the Sandfield loan scheme which converted towards the end of 2003 to dividend.

I am resident overseas now but assume emigration is not a long term solution! Have been worrying about it for years.

It would be good to hear from someone in same situation. Also if anyone can recommend some good prof advice. Not sure if these guys act on a "no win no fee" basis?

I do remember discussion about an insurance policy but wouldn't bet that I'm still covered.

[Bumfluff]

They did the loan scheme if I remeber then changed to standard MSC around 2003-2004 time.
Question for the orginal poster which scheme were you on at the time the HMRC are looking at loans or there MSC offering ?