Closing opened years - is this possible?

[eek]

In other words HMRC have completed their transition from a legally-bound tax authority to an extortion operation / mafia.
I like when things are clear.

HMRC's employees have targets to meet. How they meet those targets is of course irrelevant to people above them....

[BrilloPad]

HMRC's employees have targets to meet. How they meet those targets is of course irrelevant to people above them....

And of course HMRC have more powers than the police.

[eek]

And of course HMRC have more powers than the police.

Technically that should be Customs and Revenue not the Tax collection side but we all know how that worked out.

[starstruck]

True and for a long time this was not the case.

We are though starting to see it appear in HMRC calculations and refusing to pay it (more precisely asking HMRC why it can be charged) results in them picking up their ball and going home.

In my view this is unfair pressure on taxpayers.

So hang on, a week ago on this thread you said no interest on closed years, but now there is?! Is that in all cases (e.g. settlement now) or just in the 2019 loan charge. What has changed in the last week?

[eek]

So hang on, a week ago on this thread you said no interest on closed years, but now there is?! Is that in all cases (e.g. settlement now) or just in the 2019 loan charge. What has changed in the last week?

Probably nothing except HMRC trying it on hoping that the Tax payer doesn't have suitable qualified advisors able to pick up on the trick....

[webberg]

So hang on, a week ago on this thread you said no interest on closed years, but now there is?! Is that in all cases (e.g. settlement now) or just in the 2019 loan charge. What has changed in the last week?

I report what I see in my clients' papers and I have now seen two instances in which HMRC is insisting on "interest" on voluntary payments.

We are obviously resisting.

I remain of the view that HMRC has no legal authority to request interest on sums that are not tax.

However, their "settlement" is extra statutory and they can offer pretty much anything they want and refuse to amend it. If you don't like it, there is no compulsion to accept it.

There is however a subtle pressure and a not so subtle string of threats from HMRC about litigation, fines, worse terms later, etc.

This enquiry process has been running for a long time (17 years) and certainly in the last 3 years it feels as though something has happened pretty much every month that changes the way in which all the parties involved might react. This is not a situation in which an answer today might be 100% valid in say 3 months. It is a morass of constantly changing analysis and actions and I for one make no apology for reporting each change.

I appreciate that it sounds as though we are shifting ground all the time but we're not. If the facts change, then we change our process, not the strategy, the process.

[starstruck]

I report what I see in my clients' papers and I have now seen two instances in which HMRC is insisting on "interest" on voluntary payments.

We are obviously resisting.

I remain of the view that HMRC has no legal authority to request interest on sums that are not tax.

However, their "settlement" is extra statutory and they can offer pretty much anything they want and refuse to amend it. If you don't like it, there is no compulsion to accept it.

There is however a subtle pressure and a not so subtle string of threats from HMRC about litigation, fines, worse terms later, etc.

This enquiry process has been running for a long time (17 years) and certainly in the last 3 years it feels as though something has happened pretty much every month that changes the way in which all the parties involved might react. This is not a situation in which an answer today might be 100% valid in say 3 months. It is a morass of constantly changing analysis and actions and I for one make no apology for reporting each change.

I appreciate that it sounds as though we are shifting ground all the time but we're not. If the facts change, then we change our process, not the strategy, the process.

Adding interest to closed years that are 15+ years old would suddenly make the loan charge far more attractive than an earlier than 2019 settlement. Are you still of the opinion that the loan charge won't have interest?

[webberg]

Adding interest to closed years that are 15+ years old would suddenly make the loan charge far more attractive than an earlier than 2019 settlement. Are you still of the opinion that the loan charge won't have interest?

The HMRC webinar last week indicated that liability under the 2019 charge would be on self assessment timetables and as such a payment of any assessment no later than 31st January 2020, should not attract any interest.

[eek]

The HMRC webinar last week indicated that liability under the 2019 charge would be on self assessment timetables and as such a payment of any assessment no later than 31st January 2020, should not attract any interest.

So all loans not settled before April 5th 2019 will be treated as income received within the 2018/19 tax year and the final tax bill will need to be settled as part of a standard self assessment tax return by 31st January 2020?

I'm asking just to make things clear for people....

[starstruck]

I report what I see in my clients' papers and I have now seen two instances in which HMRC is insisting on "interest" on voluntary payments.

If interest were to make settlement no longer preferential to the loan charge, can your clients just withdraw from negotiations and wait for 2019 or are they somehow now committed to the settlement process? The mention of litigation and fines from HMRC makes me think that they are now unintentionally in a worse situation than sitting tight for 2019.