Ukip posterboy suspended after claiming 'Miliband not British'

[SaltyLevels]

Do you really have that little understanding of history? Or are you just nasty for the sake of it?

You can't compare the situation of a person whose family was persecuted with your own.

SueEllen, I am merely stating what the chap said, I have stated, many times, I don't agree with him, but stating facts. He's correct in what he said, no matter how loathesome it is, he is still correct.

[speling bee]

No, I gave back my passport, which I could get back at anytime. I was only ever technically German. I like obfuscation in an argument, but it is clearly transparent.

His parents came over here at the 11th hour after choosing, initially to move to Paris. He then spent 8 years here before being granted residency, not citizenship, in 48. He then became a naturalised Brit. His mother and father were never citizens.

Again, it's all a strawman; what this man said, clearly, was he doesn't have the genealogical make up of being british, whatever that means. In that, he is correct, that was my point, all you are doing is adding chaff, fill, for the argument stands, Milliband is not, this is a fact, genealogically british.

That's what he was saying. In that, he is correct.

I am intrigued. Are you still a German citizen?

As for Miliband, I know he is not genealogically British. But he is technically British, your point being that he is not technically British.

[SaltyLevels]

In America it does make him American.

The only true Americans are Native Americans, who are a small minority group, everyone else is an immigrant.

It's the same in Canada and Australia.

Confused here, so what you are saying are that the Millibands are Immigrants then?

Why are they Italian? Is it because they were born there, or because their parents were Italian? How far back do you need to go?
In my family, on the paternal side we have people born in different countries at least every 2 or 3 generations going back to the 1800s, so where do we draw the line?

Nationality nowadays is bollocks really, as there are such high levels of migration. I go by my passport and place of birth, which is not UK.

My mum was born in England, and to an "English" mother.
Her mother was born in England, to an "Irish" mother.
Her mother was born in Ireland, to an Irish mother.
So is my mum English? Why? Because of where she was born, or because her mother was English?
Why is her mother English? She was born in England, but her mother was Irish, so what is she?

We draw the line where we want to draw the line, that's my take on it. My friends wanted to keep their identity so did. I have no issue with this at all.

You have to remember, I don't agree with what this chap says, not at all, but the point he makes stands: if he is born to english parents abroad, he has more of a genealogical link to England than those who are not. It's just a simple fact and if you remove the emotive part of the argument and look at it logically, he's correct.

[SueEllen]

No, I gave back my passport, which I could get back at anytime. I was only ever technically German. I like obfuscation in an argument, but it is clearly transparent.

His parents came over here at the 11th hour after choosing, initially to move to Paris. He then spent 8 years here before being granted residency, not citizenship, in 48. He then became a naturalised Brit. His mother and father were never citizens.

Again, it's all a strawman; what this man said, clearly, was he doesn't have the genealogical make up of being british, whatever that means. In that, he is correct, that was my point, all you are doing is adding chaff, fill, for the argument stands, Milliband is not, this is a fact, genealogically british.

That's what he was saying. In that, he is correct.

Genealogical make up you mean not a mixture* of some of Pict, Saxon, Angle, Jute, Frisian, Roman, Viking, Norman, Danish, Scot, Irish, Romani, Huguenot, Indian (arrived in 18th Century), African (thanks to slave trade), German and Russian Jew?


*I'm sure I've missed some groups out.

[SaltyLevels]

I am intrigued. Are you still a German citizen?

As for Miliband, I know he is not genealogically British. But he is technically British, your point being that he is not technically British.

Again, the strawman: I stated he's only British by location, not by parents, which is what the other chap was alluding to. It's actually factually correct. At the time of my birth, I was German by location, not by parents, which is exactly the same thing. Trying to derail what I said into something else supporting your view is just obviously transparent.

Is he British by parents? Let's turn that around Spelngbee.

[speling bee]

SueEllen, I am merely stating what the chap said, I have stated, many times, I don't agree with him, but stating facts. He's correct in what he said, no matter how loathesome it is, he is still correct.

Is he correct?

Miliband is not a real Brit. I hope he never gets to be PM! He was only born here. I believe in being British. It is earned through generations of existence not through birth.

[speling bee]

Again, the strawman: I stated he's only British by location, not by parents, which is what the other chap was alluding to. It's actually factually correct. At the time of my birth, I was German by location, not by parents, which is exactly the same thing. Trying to derail what I said into something else supporting your view is just obviously transparent.

Is he British by parents? Let's turn that around Spelngbee.

He is British by parents, because his parents were British. Easy one.

[darmstadt]

It makes no difference if someone was themselves an immigrant. They are now British citizens and if they feel that they want the UK to choose who is invited in they are perfectly within their rights to say so. I saw a black guy being interviewed who was making exactly this point. He himself was an immigrant. The fact that he feels British and identifies with British values shows how well people like him have integrated into Britain. If people such as him feel that no more immigrants should be allowed in then good for him.

For those of you who think British nationalised immigrants should be segregated from the indigenous British and thus not entitled to support UKIP and be anti immigration are as guilty of racism as the worst extremes of BNP.

**** me, rational thought. Are you drunk?

[SueEllen]

Is he correct?

Nope - due to Milliband's family history.

He's trying to maintain a colonist view which is incorrect as well according to the 80+ year olds I've spoken to.

[SaltyLevels]

He is British by parents, because his parents were British. Easy one.

No, they weren't. They were not British and rightly proud to be Jewish Poles. They were never granted citizenship, they were granted naturalisation. They were never citizens.

I am stopping now, for you're just going around in circles.

My argument, from the get go, is that he's British by location, not genes and that as a view, is correct, factually. You can continue obfuscating with the strawman, but I am out of this one.