PM FAO Doodab's liver

[doodab]

So given the lumps on your liver, it is T4B?

So which N number are you?

Also M numbers. Get's confusing for someone with a squirrel brain like meself.

Sorry for all the questions, just can't help but think a doctor with a more aggressive approach might have better odds, and maybe you should look at second opinions or whatever.

Really sorry to butt my nose in Doodab, I mean well.

I'm T4B, it's all over my abdominal wall. Probably got there directly rather than in the blood, so at least for now my liver seems to be clean (albeit a little "fatty"), as do lungs and brain. This at least gives the chemo a decent chance.

They haven't finished counting nodes from the cat scan yet, and the scans don't show them all anyway. By this stage that doesn't really matter, the degree of spread in lymph nodes is more to do with when it's caught early and surgery to remove stomach + lymph nodes is still an option.

M number = whether it's spread. I'm M1, obviously.

My doctor(s) have been plenty aggressive and utterly fantastic at explaining what they are doing and why. Every "next" test has been lined up straight away, and they have listened to every suggestion and request, be it to use ultrasound guidance when doing the drain or just to hold off on an uncomfortable procedure for a day or two while I got my strength back from the last one.

There are actually quite a lot of them, led by a very kind faced lady who has obviously managed more suffering than you or I would really care to imagine. I have a good rapport with them and feel comfortable, I don't think you can understand just how much that counts until your going through it.

Bear in mind I have been researching this pretty thoroughly myself, it may sound arrogant but I trust my own research and opinions. I also have two friends who are doctors (although not oncologists) who I can informally ask if I have any doubts. So I don't really feel the need to take on the hassle of second opinions and further referrals which TBH probably risk delaying the start of the chemo. At the moment that is scheduled to start literally as soon as is physically possible given the wait for genetic test results.

I really am in good hands.

[doodab]

One of the pernicious things about cancer is the symptoms don't show in the early stages of some types, short of doing full body scans every 6 months it's silent. I guess one of the first questions is what might have caused it e.g. lifestyle, genetically predisposed or even virus. I hope you are in the far right tail of the curve regarding time.

Even scans won't necessarily catch some of them. I had an abdominal CT scan 2 years ago for a different reason, there was nothing there then. And they can't automatically see the primary lump on a CT scan anyway, that needs an endoscopy. You can't do those every six months for the sake of it.

I believe that some people are developing a new "breath test" for stomach cancer, so that's something.

In my case, 10+ years of smoking, lack of exercise and a diet of bacon, sausages and ham are all risk factors.

[Zippy]

I may have missed this but what are the genetic tests for?

[Mich the Tester]

All this is making me miserable. There's only one thing for it;

Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour,
That's orbiting at nineteen miles a second, so it's reckoned,
A sun that is the source of all our power.
The sun and you and me and all the stars that we can see
Are moving at a million miles a day
In an outer spiral arm, at forty thousand miles an hour,
Of the galaxy we call the 'Milky Way'.
Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars.
It's a hundred thousand light years side to side.
It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick,
But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point.
We go 'round every two hundred million years,
And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions
In this amazing and expanding universe.

The universe itself keeps on expanding and expanding
In all of the directions it can whizz
As fast as it can go, at the speed of light, you know,
Twelve million miles a minute, and that's the fastest speed there is.
So remember, when you're feeling very small and insecure,
How amazingly unlikely is your birth,
And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.

[russell]

Even scans won't necessarily catch some of them. I had an abdominal CT scan 2 years ago for a different reason, there was nothing there then. And they can't automatically see the primary lump on a CT scan anyway, that needs an endoscopy. You can't do those every six months for the sake of it.

I believe that some people are developing a new "breath test" for stomach cancer, so that's something.

In my case, 10+ years of smoking, lack of exercise and a diet of bacon, sausages and ham are all risk factors.

Yeah, smoking and processed meat/foods are proven to cause cancer, not sure on the lack of exercise though.

[BoredBloke]

Jesus - just read this thread today!! All the best Doodab!

"In my case, 10+ years of smoking, lack of exercise and a diet of bacon, sausages and ham are all risk factors."

That sounds like me!!

[mudskipper]

You seem to be taking a pragmatic approach to it all, doodab. I'm sure I'm not alone in admiring your strength and determination. As a CUKker, I've always liked and respected you - you're a straight-up guy with honesty and integrity, and that goes a long way to explaining the affection that the CUK collective feels for you and the shock that your news has given us all. The forum is a superficial place where the idea of 'friendships' seems laughable, especially with so many people projecting a persona (or multiple personas!), but I think, when the chips are down, the support, affection and sadness we all feel at your news are very real emotions.

As regards the treatment/no treatment thing - I suppose it's very difficult to quantify in terms of quality versus quantity, especially as both those variables are so hard to pin down.

Only you and your family can decide what's best - and what's best today may not still be what's best a month or six months down the line.

Anyway, I'm rambling, so will shut up and go eat a sandwich.

xxx

[mudskipper]

Yeah, smoking and processed meat/foods are proven to cause cancer, not sure on the lack of exercise though.

They're not proven to cause cancer, they're shown to increase risk. No point in beating yourself up about what you could have done differently - non-smoking teetotallers whose biggest vice is a morning coffee still get cancer.

[Mich the Tester]

You seem to be taking a pragmatic approach to it all, doodab. I'm sure I'm not alone in admiring your strength and determination. As a CUKker, I've always liked and respected you - you're a straight-up guy with honesty and integrity, and that goes a long way to explaining the affection that the CUK collective feels for you and the shock that your news has given us all. The forum is a superficial place where the idea of 'friendships' seems laughable, especially with so many people projecting a persona (or multiple personas!), but I think, when the chips are down, the support, affection and sadness we all feel at your news are very real emotions.

As regards the treatment/no treatment thing - I suppose it's very difficult to quantify in terms of quality versus quantity, especially as both those variables are so hard to pin down.

Only you and your family can decide what's best - and what's best today may not still be what's best a month or six months down the line.

Anyway, I'm rambling, so will shut up and go eat a sandwich.

xxx

WSS

MS puts it better than I can, and so does Eric Idle.

I think everyone should remember that most of the stuff we do each day, trying to 'get ahead', trying to meet some deadline (or let it sail by and keep out of the way when the tulip hits the fan), trying to get the next contract or extension, dealing with some stroppy PM and so on is actually a tiny, irrelevant heap of tulipe compared to what's important in life. A human's life, represented on a screen the size of a factory wall, might just show up as one pixel. That's all you are. You get nothing but your family and yourself and even your family can't be taken for granted. You get one chance and that's it. So laugh every day, enjoy the little things like food, sitting down for a meal together, seeing other parts of the world if possible and helping your kids grow up if you have them, and every day you have with your partner, make love like there's no tomorrow. Because maybe there isn't.

[russell]

They're not proven to cause cancer, they're shown to increase risk. No point in beating yourself up about what you could have done differently - non-smoking teetotallers whose biggest vice is a morning coffee still get cancer.

Well I think with smoking the risk is so high you can say it causes it, and indeed cancer research says exactly that.

Smoking causes more than four in five cases of lung cancer

I'm not saying also to beat yourself up, but you might want to understand what caused it, and make the lifestyle changes as you are treated.