Taxes - what taxes

[AtW]

Rather than get all worked up about it I think you might like to consider what happens when the government gets hold of the money and what happens when the company keeps it.

I've considered very carefully what happens to those who don't let the Govt take their rightful share

[lilelvis2000]

I friggen' hate it when I have to had over 20% at the end of year. I friggen' hate it. And I think to myself what has the govenment done to deserve that. Other than my business is based on UK-soil.

That's it, I'm off to the Virgin Islands.

[VectraMan]

It's not unreasonable that they pay for the infrastructure, security, legal system that they use either.

But if that investment creates 10,000 jobs for UK workers, all of whom pay full UK tax, and the company also pays other taxes like VAT, then isn't that a net gain for the UK? Why wouldn't we want that?

Does it discourage investment? Really? If someone says you can make £100 billion but you have to give £30 billion as tax do you really think "**** it, why bother?" or do you think "wahey, £70 billion quid!"

No, but maybe they think "Wahey, I could have more than £70 billion if I invest somewhere else".

Plus of course by taxing employment rather than profit you discourage employment and drive up wages because taxes on the individual must be higher to make the same tax take

If you tax dividends as income, or tax the distribution rather than the profit (to get around any overseas issues) then the tax take is the same.

and you remove any opportunity to offer tax breaks for investment or offset losses against tax, which would probably reduce risky investments such as R&D.

Good point, though in the minds of the corporation hating public, R&D and investments are just a way of them avoiding paying their fare share:

npower insists tax relief is necessary if Britain wants investment as it defends paying no corporation tax - Telegraph

In fact you could argue that the higher corporation tax is the more attractive it is to invest rather than take profits.

Again, tax the distribution not the profits. That way nobody needs to worry about any complicated rules about what's allowable for tax relief, and can just invest the cash they have in the best interests of the business.

[AtW]

But if that investment creates 10,000 jobs for UK workers, all of whom pay full UK tax, and the company also pays other taxes like VAT, then isn't that a net gain for the UK? Why wouldn't we want that?

Because all "workers" would be contractors via Ltds that don't pay any corp tax with money sent overseas into trust funds

[DimPrawn]

If I paid any tax I'd be furious.

[doodab]

But if that investment creates 10,000 jobs for UK workers, all of whom pay full UK tax, and the company also pays other taxes like VAT, then isn't that a net gain for the UK? Why wouldn't we want that?

It depends on what the infrastructure they use costs costs and what they pay people. If they are paying 10,000 people minimum wage to make widgets and exporting them the tax take is minimal, it might even cost us money to have them here.

No, but maybe they think "Wahey, I could have more than £70 billion if I invest somewhere else".

That depends on what they are doing. If they are exploiting a UK market that cannot readily be moved. They might chose to tap another market instead of the UK I suppose.

Taxing only distributed profit at the time of distribution makes a certain amount of sense, although it might have side effects like pushing down dividends or making the annual tax take less predictable, or encouraging a rush to distribute profit if the tax rate was going to go up.

[rd409]

consumption tax would only hurt the man in the street.

So who do you think ultimately pays the price for all the taxes?

[DodgyAgent]

Tax should be used to improve the lives of those not wealthy enough to pay for basic services that we as humans need. Police, NHS, schools.

It is nowhere near achieving this because people look at tax as an entitlement not as a means of bettering society. The whole way that the Occupy movement look upon it or even AtW is that everyone should pay it as some sort of punishment or means of control.

At no point does anyone ever discuss taxation in the context of what should be done with it.

[AtW]

The whole way that the Occupy movement look upon it or even AtW is that everyone should pay it as some sort of punishment or means of control.

My view is that whilst without doubt Govt should be more efficient with existing taxes and with improvements in efficiencies taxes should go down, that is not sufficiently good reason for some to pay a lot less tax than others do in same situation.

It's all nice to say Govt wastes money, however if you dodge taxes then you got no fooking right to complain about it in the first place - it's the honest taxpayers who carry the burden who have the right to whine about it.

[doodab]

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It's all nice to say Govt wastes money, however if you dodge taxes then you got no fooking right to complain about it in the first place - it's the honest taxpayers who carry the burden who have the right to whine about it.

And a lot of honest tax payers want their taxes spent on butt****ing freeloaders