Happy Birthday Euler

[sasguru]

According to patent law, integers were discovered, not invented.

Here's a discussion you might find interesting if you wish to evolve beyond your current level of abysmal ignorance. Math Forum - Ask Dr. Math

The person who most deserves that description on this thread is dooogh.
This is one of those far from clear questions that has been debated for centuries.
And to immediately insult someone because they took the opposite view is, as you say, idicative of "abysmal ignorance".

here is the offending post

Integers always existed, they just weren't discovered you clot.

[d000hg]

Insulting people who you don't agree with in your responses is your modus operandi, you hypocritical idiot.

[NotAllThere]

"Not to be taken literally", the classic religious argument, which basically translates to "not true".

Pillock - the saying is about the nature of mathematics. It's not a religious saying at all.

d000hg's post doesn't display ignorance - there's a wide school of thought that maths is a pre-existing structure, waiting to be discovered. I'm not entirely convinced, however.

[sasguru]

Insulting people who you don't agree with in your responses is your modus operandi, you hypocritical idiot.

Integers always existed, they just weren't discovered you clot.

[sasguru]

d000hg's post doesn't display ignorance - .

Oh it does. Calling someone a clot because they're in the opposite camp in a centuries-old debate is indicative of deep ignorance.

[proggy]

Pillock - the saying is about the nature of mathematics. It's not a religious saying at all.

d000hg's post doesn't display ignorance - there's a wide school of thought that maths is a pre-existing structure, waiting to be discovered. I'm not entirely convinced, however.

God created the integers? It is religious and says nothing about the nature of mathematics.

[NotAllThere]

Oh it does. Calling someone a clot because they're in the opposite camp in a centuries-old debate is indicative of deep ignorance.

Fair point. Ignorance of the debate.

The question is, as Massimo Pigluicci put it, whether mathematics is "independent of intelligent agents and their language thoughts and practices". If it is, then according to Ian Stewart - who proposes to show that the whole of mathematics can be derived from nothing = "the empty set" - the integers weren't created by anything. They arise out of nothing. On the other hand, if maths is a construct of the human mind, the integers were created by humans.

Either way, God isn't required for the integers to exist.


Massimo Pigluicci - on Mathematical Platonism - http://www.science20.com/rationally_...latonism-94345
No reference for Stewart, but I read it in one of this books...

[sasguru]

God created the integers? It is religious and says nothing about the nature of mathematics.

Oh dear. And you were doing so well.

[sasguru]

Fair point. Ignorance of the debate.

The question is, as Massimo Pigluicci put it, whether mathematics is "independent of intelligent agents and their language thoughts and practices". If it is, then according to Ian Stewart - who proposes to show that the whole of mathematics can be derived from nothing = "the empty set" - the integers weren't created by anything. They arise out of nothing. On the other hand, if maths is a construct of the human mind, the integers were created by humans.

Either way, God isn't required for the integers to exist.


Massimo Pigluicci - on Mathematical Platonism - On Mathematical Platonism
No reference for Stewart, but I read it in one of this books...

Reading, as I have lately, about multiverse theory, where "mathematics" and "physics" might be different in different "universes" has been an eye opener.
I would have thought you religious types would have jumped on that (and other interesting stuff) - finally you may have a location for heaven and hell

[proggy]

Oh dear. And you were doing so well.

Eh? how is saying God created the integers not religious? So it God created the world in 7 days not religious either?