Should DBA know to check theres no DB connections before performing a data update

[Old Hack]

No, assuming the DBA emailed everyone to announce the forthcoming upgrade, there's no need to check only to chuck, i.e. everyone off when it starts

and if any users lose a load of critical irreplaceable data, so much the better, as it means next time they'll take more notice of the DBA's emails.

Well I had assumed the down was planned and emails sent, and that any checks would be cursory, but he didn't kick anyone off, just did the update.



Like the last bit...

[MarillionFan]

Sorry guys, but, imo, if a DBA knows about loading data, which they should, they should know to make sure no one is accessing the data when loading it.

I came on to vent, but a lot of the responses seem at odds as to how I have ever operated, and all IT folk from the clients whom pay me.

I expected MF to get it wrong, for he owned clothes shops, is developing end terraces and bought too many sleds....

Yep, sorry, bit to low level for me to be concerned with. I'll let you lowly techie types get on with pissing on each others shoes & then outsource a load of you later once we work out you're overpaid, hopeless and can be replaced with Bobs.

[Spacecadet]

It's business data, so it's important. It was also on a test system.

Why the **** have you got important business data mixing with a ******* test system

And this:

Should DBA know to check theres no DB connections before performing a data update

what sort of idiot talks like that? At least try and sound semi-competent if you're going to slag someone off

[Freamon]

Any DBA worth their salt would flat out have refused to do it, not because of vague instructions, but because all good DBAs refuse to do anything at all under any circumstances.

[quackhandle]

Shirely a backup was taken before the update? Trans log?

qh

[aussielong]

It's Spatial data, it cannot be accessed and updated at the same time. The minimum I would have expected would have been to have pencilled in down time, to have bounced the spatial database at downtime, to ensure those that forgot the downtime weren't on, the upload to proceed, with applications servers also being down, then the upload being completed, then all started again.

As the application only serves the spatial data that is being updated, I don't see why they didn't consider it.

Transaction handling sorts this out usually doesn't it? Your DBAs update should not affect your users queries until it commits. Sounds like your transaction handling is wrong in your app.

Bouncing the DB would clear all your application caches wouldn't it? Then they'd have to refill on Monday morning causing performance issues- what kind of mickey mouse system is this?

[KentPhilip]

If it is a SQL Server (Microsoft) database then the only time you need to kick out all the users is if you are restoring a database from a backup. With one exception in all other situations you can make any changes you like, including dropping and re-creating tables, and users logged on won't affect that.

The one exception is if logged on users have open transactions holding locks on database objects - that will prevent changes to anything thus locked. But it is bad application design for a client to hold locks for an extended period of time.

[suityou01]

Sorry, this is an application which serves map data; the only thing they can update is the map data, and it cannot be updated whilst users are on it. That's a known part of the system.

Jesus, no wonder everyone thinks you're a ****.

Try and pull yourself out of your unimportant little life for a second and reconsider the question more generally.

HTH BISDI

[suityou01]

Well I had assumed the down was planned and emails sent, and that any checks would be cursory, but he didn't kick anyone off, just did the update.



Like the last bit...

You're clearly not important enough to be asking these questions and you chose to vent on here. In future, if you have these concerns why not raise them with someone important enough? If they are as incompetent as you point out, seize the opportunity, step up and sort it while alerting the powers that be rather than pissing and moaning on here. If you do, you could also negotiate a rate rise.

All the time know that you had to take this advice from Suity

[escapeUK]

Personally, I code all my apps to check a database table every 90 seconds which has an entry for each program name and a true or false. If true the program gracefully closes, and then refuses to start up until its back to false.

This way I can close systems down quickly, safely and no one "forgets" and goes for lunch with their screen locked and the program still running. Before I started doing this it was easy to spend 30 mins ringing around, then walking around logging people out of apps. Often after 20 mins the people who had already come out would think it was done and go back in.

But as others have said with SQL you can do an awful lot with people still using the database.