France says Britain should lose its AAA rating

[Mich the Tester]

It's not emotional or illogical at all.

I'm not talking about the specific recent incident, I'm talking about the general whinging about Europe within Britain. There is this constant carping about interference from Brussels, the Germans, the French, the simple fact is that Britain has a seat at the top table and has every opportunity to assert itself and shape things as it would like. Why not take it?

If the Europeans are too clever for us when we are in the EU they are certainly going to be a stiff challenge if we are in direct competition with them.

Sometimes Britons could be mistaken for thinking they aren't Europeans.

[doodab]

Sometimes Britons could be mistaken for thinking they aren't Europeans.

They can sometimes be mistaken for thinking anything at all.

[Mich the Tester]

They can sometimes be mistaken for thinking anything at all.

Britain is probably the most 'European' country of all. It's a microcosm of Europe.

[sasguru]

Sometimes Britons could be mistaken for thinking they aren't Europeans.

Philosophically and politically Britain isn't European.
The ideas of empiricism as espoused by Bacon, bottom-up organisation as propounded by Adam Smith, evolution rather revolution are profoundly opposed to European ideas of top-down Cartesian-rational organisation as practised on the mainland.

[sasguru]

They can sometimes be mistaken for thinking anything at all.

There are thick Britons tis true. You may fall into that category.

[DodgyAgent]

We should have the ability and confidence to take a leading role in Europe and use it to our advantage instead of constantly pleading victimhood. If we run away because we can't deal with those nasty Germans how are we going to handle the Chinese in trade negotiations?

There is nothing running away about it. You idiots do not realise that Cameron has at his disposal vast resources of accountants, bankers and everything. To have agreed the treaty would I understand have cost the UK 20 billion which he decided that the UK could not aford. The money would have gone to bail out the Greeks. he got a lot of stick from labour at PMQs and when he asked Milliband if he would have signed all Milliband could say when asked the fifth time was that he would have "stayed at the table".

And just please explain what "leading in Europe involves" this is just one of the cliches trotted out by Europhiles which is utterly meaningless.

[Mich the Tester]

Philosophically and politically Britain isn't European.
The ideas of empiricism as espoused by Bacon, bottom-up organisation as propounded by Adam Smith, evolution rather revolution are profoundly opposed to European ideas of top-down Cartesian-rational organisation as practised on the mainland.

You mean the guy who wrote lots of his works in Latin and enjoyed referring to Aristotle? Or the meat you put in sandwiches?

[Churchill]

There is nothing running away about it. You idiots do not realise that Cameron has at his disposal vast resources of accountants, bankers and everything. To have agreed the treaty would I understand have cost the UK 20 billion which he decided that the UK could not aford. The money would have gone to bail out the Greeks. he got a lot of stick from labour at PMQs and when he asked Milliband if he would have signed all Milliband could say when asked the fifth time was that he would have "stayed at the table".

And just please explain what "leading in Europe involves" this is just one of the cliches trotted out by Europhiles which is utterly meaningless.

Halle-*******-lujah!

[DodgyAgent]

Halle-*******-lujah!

I take it young Winston is snoozing or you have sneaked off leaving "er indoors" to it

[sasguru]

You mean the guy who wrote lots of his works in Latin and enjoyed referring to Aristotle? Or the meat you put in sandwiches?

A rather pathetic riposte if I may say.

Latin was the academic lingua franca of the day, bit like English is now. I'm talking about the ideas expressed: they are philosophically quite English and IMHO have coloured how Britons see the world. This way of seeing the wolrd is quite different to Europeans.
BTW It is a mistake to think that proximity implies similarity or belonging, if that were the case Pakistanis, Indians and Afghanis should be roughly the same, but in reality skin colour is the only constant.