So was the 2nd World War all for nothing?

[OwlHoot]

We'll soon have to think of a new name for France + Germany. I suggest Frankreich, because most French are ex-Germans anyway given that the Franks, from modern day Germany, occupied most of France at around the same time the Saxons were invading Britain.

[Mich the Tester]

Gentlemen, you are confusing Germany with Nazis. The WWII was fought against the Nazis who just happened to rise in Germany. The Germany of today is a much different place and this constant racial stereotyping is disgraceful.

Indeed, but I don't confuse the two. In fact I think that if there's one country in Europe that's not going to go down the route of totalitarian rule it's probably Germany.

[Arturo Bassick]

Indeed, but I don't confuse the two. In fact I think that if there's one country in Europe that's not going to go down the route of totalitarian rule it's probably Germany.

Don't bet on it. Germany has a strong nationalistic right wing section the same as any other. With issues in Europe being what they are it wouldn't take much, just like last time. The Germans have learned the lesson from last time, but may fall into it.

[sasguru]

This is the standard right winged claim that I used to believe. Unfortunately I don't believe it any more. Oh, and I've had some economic education.

That's the point, you see, when educated middle class people turn against free markets, we're all in trouble, and that's what is now happening. You won't win them back by calling them stupid.

You're still ignoring my point that it wasn't the bankers who created Europe's current mess.
Explained here:

http://forums.contractoruk.com/gener...omic-mess.html

[TwoWolves]

All is not what it seems

The Germans didn't want the Euro either. It’s a rouse by the left-wing media to make you believe that they did and most people have fallen for it.

This was all wanted by the politicians who wanted to align themselves with the strong German economy to give the Eurozone implied financial strength which it didn't have. This was required to maximise sovereign debt ratings and without it there could have been no credit binge and subsequent bust.

Its hard not to suspect a conspiracy when the consequences where so clear at inception.

[sasguru]

The Germans didn't want the Euro either. It’s a rouse by the left-wing media to make you believe that they did and most people have fallen for it.

This was all wanted by the politicians who wanted to align themselves with the strong German economy to give the Eurozone implied financial strength which it didn't have. This was required to maximise sovereign debt ratings and without it there could have been no credit binge and subsequent bust.

Its hard not to suspect a conspiracy when the consequences where so clear at inception.

Ineptness and ignorance are usually more credible explanations than conspiracy IMHO.
But yes if you're a politican on the Euro gravy train, you'll want it to be bigger rather than smaller.

[Sysman]

We'll soon have to think of a new name for France + Germany. I suggest Frankreich, because most French are ex-Germans anyway given that the Franks, from modern day Germany, occupied most of France at around the same time the Saxons were invading Britain.

Charlemagne and all that.

Rather than Frankreich I propose Allemagne.

[Mich the Tester]

Mmmmmmmmm.

Let me see if I understand this: the ratings agencies are paid by the organisations they rate.

Wot a neat trick.

They were for quite some time, yes.

[Pondlife]

Mmmmmmmmm.

Let me see if I understand this: the ratings agencies are paid by the organisations they rate.

Wot a neat trick.

Yes and their ratings are 'opinion only and should not be used for financial decisions' as they all repeatedly said in court.

[Mich the Tester]

Yes and their ratings are 'opinion only and should not be used for financial decisions' as they all repeatedly said in court.

And therefore shouldn't really be used in the computer models used by banks for deciding on creditworthiness and reporting on capital requirements according to the Basel accords?