I suggest a simple solution for IR35

[Ignis Fatuus]

For the government, that is.

Abolish NICs. Have a single uniform income tax. Fund all aspects of the state from general taxation, rather than pretending that some of the Welfare State is really an insurance system.

Bang goes the incentive for a Monday-to-Friday bum-on-seat to pretent that his income is share dividends rather than pay for his work.

Bang goes Hector's incentive to argue otherwise, because he's collecting the tax either way.

[hyperD]

Simplify the tax system with a flat rate tax!?!?

Won't somebody please think of the accountants.....

[Ignis Fatuus]

Simplify the tax system with a flat rate tax!?!?

Won't somebody please think of the accountants.....

No, I don't mean flat rate, I mean a unified tax system in that there is only one (income) tax. This was proposed in the Heath/Barber government (they abolished Surtax and integrated it into the progessive income tax, but bringing in NICs to the tax system was scheduled for after the election, which they lost).

[xoggoth]

You will never get a simplified tax system. The ordinary Joe who looks at his payslip and thinks that's what he is paying might then twig how much he really is paying.

And it employs lots of useless civil servants and accountants. Nobody should ever imagine that any service, public or private, is actually completely necessary just because it is long established, they exist mainly to line the pockets of those employed by them. Following on from recent comments about the pointless make-work jobs of most dentists, the same is true of opticians.

Cheap reading glasses ¿ready readers¿ cost £1 but can damage your sight | Mail Online

As for the law and solicitors!!! That's a topic in itself.

[xoggoth]

PS Just to save the usual person(s) a bit of time:

the same is true of opticians

Usual tedious comments about The Daily Mail here.

[xoggoth]

And MPs. 630+ MPs and similar in Lords. From memory, the US gets by with about 100 Senators and 150 congressmen for a population 5 times the size.

[krytonsheep]

The ordinary Joe who looks at his payslip and thinks that's what he is paying might then twig how much he really is paying.

I think that's the truth. I still get permie friends who say they don't want to earn over the higher rate band of 37k because they think they'll get taxed at 40% on all their earnings

I'd love to see the removal of employers NI, and just have one tax for employees (they'd obviously have to get paid more). The actually payment of employers/employees NI and PAYE is given to HMRC in one transaction, so they don't have a clue how it's divided up (until they get the yearly P35's etc).

The problem is people would suddenly realise they're being taxed a huge amount and start rioting.

[Ignis Fatuus]

You will never get a simplified tax system. The ordinary Joe who looks at his payslip and thinks that's what he is paying might then twig how much he really is paying.

And it employs lots of useless civil servants and accountants. Nobody should ever imagine that any service, public or private, is actually completely necessary just because it is long established, they exist mainly to line the pockets of those employed by them. Following on from recent comments about the pointless make-work jobs of most dentists, the same is true of opticians.

Cheap reading glasses ¿ready readers¿ cost £1 but can damage your sight | Mail Online

As for the law and solicitors!!! That's a topic in itself.

True enough, Emplyer's NIC is a good way of hiding the extent of tax from the voters.

Dentists make just enough work to suit them, IMHO. I get regular checkups and always seem to need 1 filling. Funny that, if I needed 10 fillings it would still be 1 course of work and the NHS dentist would get paid the same. I went to a private dentist recently and was told that I did in fact need many fillings. But then he would get paid more for that. I need a 3rd opinion....

As for opticians, the govt forced them to give you free of charge the prescription from the eye test that you paid for. Until then, many would charge you for having the nerve not to buy their overpriced glasses. Most still do charge e.g. £25 for a 1-page print of your contact lens prescripton, just because they can still get away with that. That tells you all you need to know about their prices and their business.

Solicitors are of course the worst. My partner divorced amicably from her husband, and they agreed on everything. But their solicitors kept writing to each other making demands of the other party that were completely at odds with what the parties had already agreed between themselves. Every such demand would be another letter-writing fee on the bill. Then every complaint from the customer that they had breached their instructions would also get another letter-writing fee on the bill! Only lawyers can charge you a fortune to go against your wishes, then another fortune for saying sorry (sort of).

[Ignis Fatuus]

And MPs. 630+ MPs and similar in Lords. From memory, the US gets by with about 100 Senators and 150 congressmen for a population 5 times the size.

Switzerland's parliament meets four times a year, for 2 weeks each session. The Swiss don't want them doing more than that and making a nuisance of themselves.

OTOH the fruit and veg market on the square outside the parliament bulding meets every week. Priorities, I suppose.

[Platypus]

I think that's the truth. I still get permie friends who say they don't want to earn over the higher rate band of 37k because they think they'll get taxed at 40% on all their earnings

Indeed, same here. It must be the most common mis-conception about the tax system.
People seem surprised and rather incredulous when I explain how it works.
They tell you about a bloke they once heard of who didn't want a pay rise because it would have taken him into top-rate-tax and as a result his take-home pay would have been lower than before. Thus illustrating that they still don't get it and still don't believe you.