1001 reasons NEVER to vote TORY

[DodgyAgent]

[QUOTE=Jabberwocky]

I thought the German economy thrived after Hitler was dead and after the war. Correct me if I am wrong QUOTE]

No Germany flourished when Hitler came to power in the thirties and there were plenty of state handouts - for infrastructure, armaments, mothers, children, motorways, railways. Hitler poured cash into the German economy which was raped by the captialist governments of the US, Britain after WWI. He provided jobs and prosperity for a while.

Every right wing goverment gives state handouts - thing is it goes to the rich corporates rather than the poor. Take the US and Haliburtion for example.

So where did East Germany go so wrong with their command "jobs for all" economy?

[Bagpuss]

They keep saying that they are going to leave yet they dont. Like all socialists they dont keep their promises. Maybe they should throw away their politicas and become recruitment agents

Mind you they would not be able to claim that their earnings were as a result of "hard work", they would have to change to "ill gotten"

Isn't it better to have some healthy debate? We could just stereotype and self congradulate all day. Most people on this board are very similar, sometimes it's refreshing to get other perspectives even if you disagree.
This doesn't mean the other person's views are invalid.

My perosnal opinion of the Thatcher years is not one of some Utopia where every policy was justified or the best approach neither do I think it hasn't benefitted the country in certain ways, anyone can see it has. There were many mistakes made but ultimately the nation had to head that way. I think some of the 'medicine' was a little too harsh, in many ways she did the opposite of what Blair has done, i.e. disgard a large swathe of the population you believe not important or not neccesary to help you maintain power. Tony Blair is very like Thatcher in alot of ways, only not so extreem. He too is caught up in his own devisive docterine, the only breath of fresh air I can see is coming from Cameron, he can see that devisive politics isn't the way forward, if the left have a good idea then support it and vice versa, I believe pre war this was very much the way. The pathetic party politics this country has decended into is riddiculous.

[Dundeegeorge]

Jumbowanker

Well DG lets just look back in history to a time when there was no welfare state - say the 19th century - was that a time of supreme opportunity and enterprise for the British people at the height of the industrial revolution - or were people working in the poor houses and sweatshops ?

No you earns lots of money and you don't want anyone else getting their hands on it - you are a conceited, self-centered tw*t.

I would be offended by that if you weren't such a stupid bottom-feeding braindead s*c**l*st c*nting troll.
The 19th century was not a great time of opportunity for anyone.
This century is entirely different. There is plenty of work for people who choose to do it. Why do you think so many people want to come here to live you cretinous f*ckhead. You really don't see it, do you.
People attach value to things depending on how much effort it takes to get them. I value the money I earn because I EARN IT. I see no reason why the money THAT I EARN should go to some braindead waste of skin who's going to raise more braindead wastes of skin to piss MY MONEY up the wall, just so that a bunch of self-loathing angst-ridden middle-class ****wits can be elected yet again to socially engineer the country into a third-world one.
And further, I wouldn't even object if the aforesaid wastes of skin took MY MONEY and pissed it up the wall and left it at that, provided that in the process they don't incur even more costs for the state by stealing anything that isn't nailed down and by destroying anything that isn't. In fact I do have some sympathy with the WOS because they really don't know any better, because successive governments have ****ed them over educationally and socially. It's braindead f*ckwit apologists for NL like you that really piss me off. You're certainly a prime candidate for a lethal injection in my book.

[benn0]

The funniest thing about all this debate is that many of you cannot see beyond your beloved tories. I am the first to admit that despite my (slight) socialist leanings, the current labour government has a lot to answer for.

It really wouldn't bother me which government was in power at the moment. I am happy getting on with my life despite the social problems we currently face (and always will and have).

In addition to dismantling the admittedly sick puppies, your beloved maggie systematically destroyed industries which were doing fine, so much so that there was no manufacturing sector to talk of in the early 80s. Watch 'Auf Wiedersehen Pet' to get an idea of the sense of despair prevalant at the time in the building trade for example.

And she didn't redistribute wealth from the poor to the rich? Don't make me laugh. Who do you think the introduction of the 15% VAT rate and prescription charges had the most impact on? Net result - Less money in the pockets of the lower paid, less spending, less fuel to drive the economy. That woman is responsible for the social underclass we have formed over the last twenty years.

Still, as long as those of you with Rich mummies and daddies were and are OK.

[mcquiggd]

Still, as long as those of you with Rich mummies and daddies were and are OK.

Thank god for that.

[hyperD]

despite my (slight) socialist leanings

Watch 'Auf Wiedersehen Pet' to get an idea of the sense of despair prevalant at the time in the building trade for example.

Still, as long as those of you with Rich mummies and daddies were and are OK.

MEDIC!

[Dundeegeorge]

Hands up anybody with rich mummies or daddies

Not me.
Working class background raised in a council house (and mostly single-parent).

[mcquiggd]

Well my dad didnt even get his 11 plus.. served in the army in Suez.. then due to sheer talent and hard work had an amazing career that saw him become an advisor for the World Bank, sign contracts on TV for 5 million back in the 70's, and learn Italian and Japanese.

To be honest, he is a tough act to follow.

[Lucifer Box]

Rich Parents? Not Here.

Me neither. Dad worked at Cadbury's and my mum was a cleaner at the post office.

[Mordac]

>In addition to dismantling the admittedly sick puppies, your beloved maggie systematically destroyed industries which were doing fine, so much so that there was no manufacturing sector to talk of in the early 80s. Watch 'Auf Wiedersehen Pet' to get an idea of the sense of despair prevalant at the time in the building trade for example.


So the trade unions had nothing to do with it whatsoever? In the 1970s people went to work at places like British Leyland just so they could warm their hands around a burning brazier, and save money on their heating bills at home. The building trade suffered because Britain was virtually a 3rd world country (thanks in part to several years of inflation at >20% courtesy of a certain Mr Healey, and a Labour government who couldn't dare upset the unions) and nobody had a pot to piss in, let alone build anything.
It is precisely because the Tory government of the 80s decided enough was enough and some seriously hard measures were needed, that Britain now has a strong economy and your "New Labour" boys and girls have got plenty of cash to piss up the wall.
Do you remember the 70s? Thanks to Mrs T it now seems as though it never happened. And now you want to blame her for the demise of manufacturing industry, while conveniently forgetting we had no industry to speak of, just unions competing to see who could have the most strikes.
If you can name a single industry which was unnecessarily "killed off" in the 80s I will happily concede the point to you, but I don't think there is one. All died because they couldn't compete with the rest of the world and the taxpayer wasn't prepared to bail them out any longer.