European Currency

[Doggy Styles]

What an astonishing statement. with an assertion at the end that someone else doesnt understand economics!!

Just who's interests are exchange rates supposed to be in?

If they are set in the UK by a UK govt then presumably we have the right to set them as suits the UK? If the govt gets them wrong then we change the government. Not so the Euro. Exchange rates with the Euro are set fpr the common interest of the EU and they have ended up being wrong for everyone in the EU - too high to stimulate German spending and too low to curtail Irish spending.

Neither Ireland nor Germany can do anything about managing their own economies.

You seem to believe that there should be some puritanical policy of high interest rates enforced, preventing borrowing as if borrowing like teenage sex is some sort of immoral activity what a miserable, arrogant "I'm all right Jack" old fart you are... Why not go one step further and stone anyone with a mortgage?

If you think that the EU states will converge into the same economic cycles as each other then just look at the last 10 years of the Euro .. it will never happen. Even in the UK there are disparities in parts of the economy that would require a two tier surrency system.

WHS

Sterling is not some little englander vestage of the past as some would have it - it is a vital for controlling our own economy.

[The Lone Gunman]

WHS

Sterling is not some little englander vestage of the past as some would have it - it is a vital for controlling our own economy.

but the fact that you see it as controlling "our own economy" is indicative of the "little Englander though you mean UK" mentality.
That is the entire problem with Europe and the Euro. The whole thing is just about nation states trying to mould the whole thing to best suit them and not to use it to unite all member nations.
It can not work how they (European institutions representatives and supporters) present it to us (European citizens) unless all the Nation states commit to being one unit under one government with one economy.

They and we need to decide which way we are going. Total unification in which case we give up national identities in all but name and tradition or falling back to being a common market with agreed trading rules. This half arsed psuedo financial and political alignment is never going to work.

[Doggy Styles]

It can not work how they (European institutions representatives and supporters) present it to us (European citizens) unless all the Nation states commit to being one unit under one government with one economy.

Which nations' people want that?

There are so many diverse micro-economies in Europe that it would be impossible to have one size fits all for a currency OR government. Even in England we have a north-south split, and Scotland are using their own limited tax and budgetary powers to diverge.

[Smurficus]

How do the Americans do it then? They seem to have one currency and the states setting slightly different taxes to suit their populations.

I don't claim any knowledge of economics but is this not what the EU should be?

[The Lone Gunman]

Which nations' people want that?

There are so many diverse micro-economies in Europe that it would be impossible to have one size fits all for a currency OR government. Even in England we have a north-south split, and Scotland are using their own limited tax and budgetary powers to diverge.

Oh, I agree entirely. That has been my stance for a long long time.
It may be possible for Europe and the Euro to work, but it will require incredible amounts of commitment from the member states.
The only small scale working example is the UK. As you rightly point out, that does not seem to be working too well these days.

[PM-Junkie]

How do the Americans do it then? They seem to have one currency and the states setting slightly different taxes to suit their populations.

I don't claim any knowledge of economics but is this not what the EU should be?

No it is not. The EU was originally set up as a trading block. That is what we signed up to on the one occasion we were given a vote - the USA was set up as a federal constitutional republic from the original 13 colonies in 1788, not by forcibly amalgamating 13 countries. Poll after poll has demonstrated that right across Europe people are against creating a federal nation of Europe - and when a democratic vote is held on anything approaching the subject, it is ignored.

Unless the EU becomes a single economic entity, with uniform fiscal and monetary policy, the Euro WILL NOT WORK. Eventually it will fail - it has to. Anyone who thinks it won't is either naive or blind. That is why the constitution is being forced through and that is why written into the constitution are tools to accomplish a single european monetary and fiscal entity. Loads of examples - to name but three; article 14 gives the EU power to dictate how and to what level public services are financed; article 114 lays out powers for the EU to enforce economic "guidelines", and most crucially, article 48 stipulates that once ratified, ANY changes can be made to the constitution through QMV. So the much vaunted "red lines" that Brown brags about are worthless.

The government of the UK may be completely incompetent when it comes to economics, but they have been democratically elected, and can be removed in the same way. The Euro is a huge step toward moving that power to a bunch of people who are not democratically elected, despite even proponents of a federal europe agreeing that that is not the wish of the majority of the people of europe. Couple the Euro with the constitution, and it's a done deal. Notice how when a vote is taken on anything related to building a federal europe and it goes against the big plan, it is ignored. Why do you suppose that is?

Nope, you can keep the Euro thanks - I'll settle for having a bunch of corrupt incompetent idiots that can be democratically removed rather than a bunch of corrupt incompetent idiots that are untouchable.

[tino]

We should just make Sterling the global currency and be done with it

[BlasterBates]

I don't think the Eurozone is going to break up. We're already through the worst part of the crisis.

[Cyberman]

I don't think the Eurozone is going to break up. We're already through the worst part of the crisis.

It may not break up but all of the involved countries will suffer economic problems due to it as the interest rate will always be out of kilter for a number of member states. The UK is in a very strong position out of the Euro as long as we can get rid of incompetent Labour.

We should remove ourselves from a federal EU ASAP but remain a faithful trading partner.

[PM-Junkie]

We should just make Sterling the global currency and be done with it

yeah absolutely....everything goes belly up when we pull out. I mean, look at what's happened to the USA.

<runs for cover>