Oath of allegiance to the queen.

[The Lone Gunman]

Sorry to be pushing your buttons, LG but thanks for making the time.

The debate seems to be falling into two camps, those with a degree of historical perspective... and those with a hysterical one

All constructs such as Monarchy and State and the boundaries drawn on a map are impermanent, and created by people, usually a long time ago and then justified by people today to serve their version of "truth". Over time they all get replaced.

I choose to be loyal to my friends and family, (also impermanent, but has meaning to me) is there something wrong with that?

I am just having lunch while the concrete rests.

It seems to me that the right to live and prosper in the UK these days is seen as an inalianble right for those born here (and for many migrants too).
What I am saying is that with those rights come responsibilities and like it or not loyalties.

The permanence of the state is irrelevant. It still provides rights and protections.
It seems that you and others wish to avail yourself of those rights and protections without making any commitment to the state.

As I have said. Those of you who do not agree with being loyal to the state should give up all the rights and protections it affords, even to the extent of leaving.

[cailin maith]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7287984.stm

1st step on the path to reclaiming our empire. What ho.

What flipin planet are these people living on?

OK being a Jock and republican (Not the Irish/terrorist kind) and a Celtic fan I may be slightly biased, but still seems like a dumb idea all the same.

Snaw will you change that - it should be Irish terrorist not Irish/Terrorist - makes it seem like we are all terrorists.....

[Cheshire Cat]

She has, dummy, as part of the oath sworn at her coronation.

Oh well, I stand corrected. No need for the "dummy" though.

[shaunbhoy]

Why is it as soon as someone starts a debate on a subject that those who disagree always cite extremes as examples to support their stance?

Desperation?

[Marina]

I sometimes feel that people forget our Monarch is the Head of State and is only there because in the past her family were a gang of ruthless thugs who trampled over everyone who wasn't able to stand up to them.

and people like threaded forget that in those days the winners were usually pretty good at protecting our forbears from even worse foreign ruthless thugs.

You can't blame HMQ's ancestors (and most of our own) for being thuggish if that was the only game in town.

[The Lone Gunman]

No need for the "dummy" though.

That is the CUK way mon brave.

[Marina]

Oh well, I stand corrected. No need for the "dummy" though.

Sorry, I'm in a grumpy mood this morning. An hour stuck in a traffic jam yesterday evening, then another hour on the way to work this morning

edit: Damn, TLG is right. Why did I have to go and apologise? ;-)

[snaw]

Snaw will you change that - it should be Irish terrorist not Irish/Terrorist - makes it seem like we are all terrorists.....

You can be Irish and republican and not a terrorist Cailin.

And in response to a couple of digs, I'm perfectly ok with the concept of being loyal to the state, it's the swearing an oath of loyalty towards the queen part of it I'm not ok with. I feel nothing towards the royal family, and certainly not respect (The queen seems like a good enough person, but there are plenty of other Britains I admire more), for many reasons - historical and current.

[sasguru]

Why is it as soon as someone starts a debate on a subject that those who disagree always cite extremes as examples to support their stance?

Nuance is not your strong point is it? Read my post carefully - it suggests that some loyalty to the state is to be hoped for.

[The Lone Gunman]

My nation, right or wrong? Look where that left the Germans ...
Blind loyalty is as dangerous as no loyalty.

Good job the rest of the world showed the same loyalty to state or else we would all be wearing the Nazi uniform.


Wanders of singing..... Tomorrow belongs, tomorrow belongs........