Housing Shortage

[Old Greg]

It'll all be academic soon when the first cases of incurable TB* that kills you in a month start turning up...

(*not a joke by the way, this exists in Southern Africa).

Not heard of that one. Incuable or untreatable? Any idea where I can read up on it?

[Moscow Mule]

Not heard of that one. Incuable or untreatable? Any idea where I can read up on it?

http://www.who.int/mediacentre/facts.../en/print.html

[Old Greg]

New Scientist 3 or 4 weeks ago... does not respond to any combination of the usual drugs...

Cooool - I'll have a read, sounds interesting. Then I'll reactivate my Y2K emergency bunker immediately. At least the booze will still be in date.

[Ardesco]

There is no definitive answer, I have given a whole load of evidence and I get little back from you apart from this is not America. I know that, can you tell me why perhaps that poorly educated immigrants in the US should do worse/better/same than a similar person in the UK? Infact the only difference I can see if that healthcare is free here and so the cost of that is not born by the US in their case. This would tend to drive my arguments to concluding even worse than the US. Do you have anything else? Citing differences without consideration of how those differences are likely to effect assessments of a situation is not that helpful.

For a start we are a bloody island. We don't have any land borders or sea borders (that are close enough to get accross in a non-ocean going vessel) with any third world countries, or countries with communist governments that the populous is trying to escape from. they are going to have a much higher percentage of poorly educated immigrants than we are because of this.

If I ate nothing but apples all day and you started shouting about how bad pears were, how would that affect me ?? USA != UK therefore USA immigration issues != UK immigration issues. I could probably pull up a load of figures that shows how Switzerland doesn't have an immigration problem, how would that have any meaning on the UK's immigration problems.

The fact that you cannot see that this is a problem just goes to show you don't have a lcue what you are talking about!!!

[DodgyAgent]

Let me explain. 90% is my estimate of immigrants who do not pay their way, it is based on the following information taken from Andrew Brownes assessment. Quote: Immigrants overall do pay more in tax than they receive in benefits and consume in public services, but only because immigrants from North America, Japan and the EU pay so much more than their fair share. Immigrants from the Third World—who make up the entire net immigration to the UK—are on average less well educated, suffer higher unemployment, claim more of most forms of benefits, make more demands on public services such as schools and hospitals, and almost certainly do not pay their way on average. There are no figures for the UK, but official studies in the US show that the average adult Mexican immigrant will consume throughout their life time $55,200 more in services than they contribute in taxes.

(This assessment was made in 2001 before the eastern EUs were included in the EU statement above).

CD: They do not pay their way on average, they have more children, they have more elderly parents who were brought here never having worked at all, they are less educated, they suffer high unemployment. The US data suggest that the average poorly educated immigrant consumes quite a bit more than they pay tax. UK data do not exist but surely the trend is there for all to see, or would you like to concentrate on my faults again? I think people would be best advised to open their eyes to what is happening. As I said a small proportion of immigrants from developed countries pay inordinate amounts that enable people to justify all immigration. We should run the UK like a business, would you have 2-3 top sellers in your business making you loads of dough and stop there or would you have 10 to get very little more?

Another important aspect is the importation of disease. The esteemed poster Bagpuss pointed this out a few days ago. We have imported most of our HIV (hetero), if I apply the rate of growth amongst the indigenous population over the last 10 years to our new cases. The HIV burden will be over 1 million people in just 20 years. At 15K a year to treat, 15 thousand million (15 billion a year), that will be pounds not chocolate buttons.

One doesn’t have to be an economist, mathematician or statistician to follow this, it just doesn’t make economic sense and of course the social consequences are for all to see already. If we get our own people to do these jobs we wouldn’t have to fork out dough for nowt for them also.

I got accused of being a wind up merchant yesterday, I think one of those is someone who comes back with no alternative information spending 30 seconds to conjure up a cheap shot and claim victory.

Your statistics may be correct and so may many other of the things you say. But either because you are a racist or you are a tad on the thick side the way you put your points is done in such a way as to apply your criticisms to ALL members of ethnic groups. So the effect that it has is to stir up hatred of entire groups instead of putting things into any sort of objective context

[Causus Deli]

[QUOTE=Old Greg]

Let me explain. 90% is my estimate ...your information before starting to address your points (although God only knows why I'm bothering).

Hey you musn't bother yourself, it's all common sense anyway. I don't think people change their mind on these things, but if you want a read, here you go.

Have a great day and chill out, Pimms in the garden, 5pm, mine, OK?

http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/cs23.pdf

[Causus Deli]

New Scientist 3 or 4 weeks ago... does not respond to any combination of the usual drugs...

HIV tends to kill you too.

[DodgyAgent]

HIV tends to kill you too.

I see the battleground has been neatly shifted to aids. How many Polish immigrants did you say are HIV positive?

[Causus Deli]

Your statistics may be correct and so may many other of the things you say. But either because you are a racist or you are a tad on the thick side the way you put your points is done in such a way as to apply your criticisms to ALL members of ethnic groups. So the effect that it has is to stir up hatred of entire groups instead of putting things into any sort of objective context

There you go couldn't resist the R....... word could you. Thick, I think you know that that is not so.

[Causus Deli]

I see the battleground has been neatly shifted to aids. How many Polish immigrants did you say are HIV positive?

Are you coded in machine code?