Best way to pay off student loans?

[Gibbon]

I just struggle with charging students £27k for course fees when we had it all for free. Just doesn't sit well with me.

But only a select few, therein lies the problem. If you increased tax then you are hitting the people who can't for some reason go to Uni. Uni is a choice, not a necessity on an individual level, yes a modern economy needs an educated workforce, but there are ways of getting that for most roles without Uni. Bog standard software engineers/spreadsheet jockeys patently do not need a degree in the subject.

[TheDude]

It's nowhere near £400k extra earnings for most graduates now.

However, if you've got a Computer Science degree from Oxford, you are the highest paid new graduate in the country - £65k median salary after a year. That's about double the national average.

That is because it is a proper degree.

Most computer science courses are little better than training courses for Java and SQL.

[TheDude]

Apprenticeships! Especially for general IT and software engineering. I'm technically mentoring a final year apprentice (which is also final year degree) at the moment. The work she is doing is far above any of her uni work from what I've seen (they have no fecking idea about multi-threading in a pseudo real-time system).

Some of the most limited developers I have encountered are those who believe software development should be some sort of chartered profession and who have wasted their time with worthless BCS and similar accreditations.

[vetran]

Some of the most limited developers I have encountered are those who believe software development should be some sort of chartered profession and who have wasted their time with worthless BCS and similar accreditations.

Some of the poorest quality developers I have worked with are the ones who just Nike it then leave a wave of tulip in their wake.

Its a bit of both.

[TheDude]

Some of the poorest quality developers I have worked with are the ones who just Nike it then leave a wave of tulip in their wake.

Its a bit of both.

It is but there are plenty of developers out there capable of producing high quality software without a hefty layer of process.

[vetran]

It is but there are plenty of developers out there capable of producing high quality software without a hefty layer of process.

and plenty that aren't. Why do you think that layer of official process exists? I bet I can guess what you will say.

[TheDude]

and plenty that aren't. Why do you think that layer of official process exists? I bet I can guess what you will say.

Heavyweight process exists so that nuclear power stations don't explode and aircraft don't fall out of the sky.

If your business has to move quickly then you have to rely on skilled developers who can produce the goods at pace and mitigate the risks associated with this approach.



Many years ago I ended up working on trading system implemented in Ada 83!

As a consequence of using Ada many of the project hires came from defence/safety critical backgrounds and could barely write a line of code with out a spec the size of a phone book. That approach may have been appropriate writing air traffic control software but was not appropriate in the market we operated in.

[vetran]

Heavyweight process exists so that nuclear power stations don't explode and aircraft don't fall out of the sky.

If your business has to move quickly then you have to rely on skilled developers who can produce the goods at pace and mitigate the risks associated with this approach.



Many years ago I ended up working on trading system implemented in Ada 83!

As a consequence of using Ada many of the project hires came from defence/safety critical backgrounds and could barely write a line of code with out a spec the size of a phone book. That approach may have been appropriate writing air traffic control software but was not appropriate in the market we operated in.

You changed the question having realised you couldn't answer mine sensibly?

Process is necessary and should be appropriate for the job you are doing.

Lack of process will instantly identify your level of professional maturity.

[SueEllen]

A lot more than the maximum (home) fees for all subjects involving lab work. There are massive cross-subsidies from the humanities.

I remember seeing the costs for about 3 unis in the 00s. It explained why unis were eager to get foreign students on to their STEM courses especially postgraduate ones.

[TheDude]

I remember seeing the costs for about 3 unis in the 00s. It explained why unis were eager to get foreign students on to their STEM courses especially postgraduate ones.

I did a year of Chemical Engineering in the late 80s and about 80% of the course where from Kuwait.