As a lifelong Tory I'm disgusted with the Tory party

[jamesbrown]

God forbid that we go down the extremist remain approach, and end up like Germany.

If you listen to people like Alistair Campbell, A.C. Grayling and Michael Heseltine, the extremist Remain approach is more akin to the Weimar Republic. They don't respect the mechanisms of democracy, flawed or otherwise. For them, it's just a means to an end, and when it isn't their end, the toys exit the pram. That's far more dangerous than our departure from the EU.

[BlasterBates]

If you listen to people like Alistair Campbell, A.C. Grayling and Michael Heseltine, the extremist Remain approach is more akin to the Weimar Republic. They don't respect the mechanisms of democracy, flawed or otherwise. For them, it's just a means to an end, and when it isn't their end, the toys exit the pram. That's far more dangerous than our departure from the EU.

The comparison with the Weimar republic is a good one, when the democrats were labelled extremists by National Socialists.

[northernladyuk]

Looking after the Tory party first and not the national interest is just plain wrong.

As a lifelong Tory, you've not really got the hang of this Tory thing yet.

[northernladyuk]

What is a joke is that you vote on a manifesto, they win it, and then she decided to abandon core parts of it.

If they had won, you wouldn't be sleeping in the kennel.

[sasguru]

As a lifelong Tory, you've not really got the hang of this Tory thing yet.

Plenty of other lifelong Tories who agree with me.

[VectraMan]

If you listen to people like Alistair Campbell, A.C. Grayling and Michael Heseltine, the extremist Remain approach is more akin to the Weimar Republic. They don't respect the mechanisms of democracy, flawed or otherwise. For them, it's just a means to an end, and when it isn't their end, the toys exit the pram. That's far more dangerous than our departure from the EU.

Heseltine on the telly yesterday made the point that he's been listening to Brexiteers trying to get their way for over 30 years, and that to argue for what you believe is right for the country isn't wrong, or undemocratic, but is exactly what politics is. The "shut up you lost" cry of the Brexiteers certainly isn't respecting democracy.

To be a Brexiteer means ignoring the original referendum, and ignoring the fact that every government the people elected since the the UK joined has been pro-EU (with the exception of the weak and wobbly one elected the other day). The danger you describe is exactly what's already happened. The extremists have seized control; moderates are now dismissed as "undemocratic".

I'm shocked that I voted for Corbyn. I'd still rather have the centre-right Pro-EU Cameron government with 3 years left on their term. But that's where Brexitism has led us.

[VillageContractor]

Looking after the Tory party first and not the national interest is just plain wrong.
What this election has shown is that a substantial portion of this country does not agree with Teresa's May's rhetoric and approach.
The first thing the Tories should do is form a cross-party negotiating team for Brexit.
This is too important an issue for ideas to come from just one party - it's akin to a national emergency.
And frankly the extremists should be ignored.
By pandering to the right-wing extremists, May released the spectre of the opposite, left-wing extremists.
That's how it always plays out in history. Extremism breeds extremism.
Abandon the centre at your peril.
The country voted for Brexit, it didn't vote for chaos and poverty.

I was we did this for a lot more things to ensure that we do what's best for the country not just the party

[OwlHoot]

I think one German politician over the weekend said that the UK is heading to be the first, first world country to end up as a failed state.

Well that's a bit rich, considering Germany itself ended up as a "failed state" both after WW1 and after WW2!

[BlasterBates]

Well that's a bit rich, considering Germany itself ended up as a "failed state" both after WW1 and after WW2!

True, but since they joined the EU though things are looking up.

[jamesbrown]

Heseltine on the telly yesterday made the point that he's been listening to Brexiteers trying to get their way for over 30 years, and that to argue for what you believe is right for the country isn't wrong, or undemocratic, but is exactly what politics is. The "shut up you lost" cry of the Brexiteers certainly isn't respecting democracy.

To be a Brexiteer means ignoring the original referendum, and ignoring the fact that every government the people elected since the the UK joined has been pro-EU (with the exception of the weak and wobbly one elected the other day). The danger you describe is exactly what's already happened. The extremists have seized control; moderates are now dismissed as "undemocratic".

I'm shocked that I voted for Corbyn. I'd still rather have the centre-right Pro-EU Cameron government with 3 years left on their term. But that's where Brexitism has led us.

Tripe. He's free to argue for the benefits of EU membership, but he isn't free to argue that a democratic process should be ignored (without significant pushback) because it undermines democracy itself (about which he clearly doesn't give two figs). This isn't about freedom of speech, it's about the outcome of a democratic process. The European Research Group can whine all they want, but they aren't disrespecting the outcome of a recent referendum. By your logic w/r to "ignoring the original referendum", every democratic vote ignores the result of a previous democratic vote that reached a different conclusion, which is self-evidently facile. Heseltine and others are extremists because they propose to ignore the outcome of the referendum, not seek to interpret that outcome in a particular way (means of departure) or to argue for the benefits of EU membership in general, both of which are perfectly legitimate.