“I think I’d better leave now."

[PurpleGorilla]

Well UK started this tulip, it wasn't EU that voted to kick UK out.

So now UK will have to rely on good will of many EU members not just for exit, but also for the future to influence laws passed by EU by virtue of having friends. Therefore it makes perfect sense to do gesture of good will and offer gurantees to EU citizens living in UK - it's cheap because UK will have to do it anyway, no point, stupid and downright offensive to use them as hostages

Making Brexit a success isn't even possible (days of offshore tax heavens are gone and too many people in UK for it anyway), only super competent people got a chance to minimise damage from Brexit, but it turns out that the lunatics are running the show, this can only end in Shakespearian tradegy

No.

We have probed this, with positive and encouraging gestures, and we have been met with a cold no.

I get that negotiations haven't started, but a bit of 'it is our wish' from the other side would be constructive.

If we have to pull up the drawbridge on our expats, so be it. But the olive branch has been extended.

All this points to hard brexit. Nothing will be agreed so that is the only default - that or some purgatory transitional tulip.

[GB9]

If we were rich and powerful (like the Brexiters wrongly assumed because they can't do simple maths ) we could demand things.
The reality is that economically we are weak, we don't make enough things to trade, we are in huge debt, we're running 2 huge deficits and our largest industry, finance, on which we depend, is dependent on passporting.

It's a clusterfook, and like AtW says, we don't have the quality of leader to get us out of the bind you stupid Brexiters have put us in.

Weak yet stronger than the rest?

This is about people. It should have no influence on the economics.

We could agree a deal now that guarantees the rights of both sets of expats but the EU says 'no' so it can use people as pawns.

[NickFitz]

No.

We have probed this, with positive and encouraging gestures, and we have been met with a cold no.

I get that negotiations haven't started, but a bit of 'it is our wish' from the other side would be constructive.

If we have to pull up the drawbridge on our expats, so be it. But the olive branch has been extended.

All this points to hard brexit. Nothing will be agreed so that is the only default - that or some purgatory transitional tulip.

Again, saying "**** you lot, we don't need you to do {thing}" followed by "You should put yourselves out to give us a hand doing {thing} and if you don't you're a bunch of *****" can't really be characterised as being positive, encouraging, or extending any kind of branch other than a tulipty stick

[AtW]

So us wanting to leave justifies the EU treating its clones as dirt does it?

And we didn't 'start'. We voted to leave the circumstances we didn't vote to get in to in the first place.

Why we would make a massive gesture without reciprocation is beyond me. I can only assume the EU declined the offer as it wants to use UK people as pawns.

The leaving bit only starts when Article 50 is envoked, referendum was not binding and advisory, the UK Govt is under no obligations to do anything and neither is EU

The vote is weak anything - 2% difference either way is no mandate for exit or say joining euro if the result went the other way.

The EU got very strong negotiating position and they can wait, where as stupid May locked herself into deadline

[AtW]

No.

We have probed this, with positive and encouraging gestures, and we have been met with a cold no.

I get that negotiations haven't started, but a bit of 'it is our wish' from the other side would be constructive.

If we have to pull up the drawbridge on our expats, so be it. But the olive branch has been extended.

All this points to hard brexit. Nothing will be agreed so that is the only default - that or some purgatory transitional tulip.

Brexit can only be hard - it's a pity that Brexiters did not bother to explain that before vote, guess that would not have gotten the slight majority result, eh?

[sasguru]

Weak yet stronger than the rest?

I think the best retort to a stupid statement like that is, let's see, shall we?

[shaunbhoy]

I think the best retort to a stupid statement like that is, let's see, shall we?

[ClothCap]

Ooh they're angry today aren't they? Won't change anything though!

[sasguru]

Won't change anything though!

You're right, the country is going to be fooked, Brexiters in particular.

[ClothCap]

Ha ha, classic!