Why I'll be voting to stay in Europe

[seanraaron]

Try reading what he says and disprove or counter it. Ad hominen attack on Brooker is lazy

I've read it and don't understand why it matters. The people who architected the European Union conceived of it as a step-by-step progress to a single European state. And?

[OwlHoot]

2016-02-25 If the arch-Europhile Lord Owen wants out of the EU, it should make us all stop and think

Many of those clamouring for Britain to leave the European Union have always loathed it. Not so David Owen. All of his political life, he has been a proud European – and has been prepared to stake his career on it. He resigned from Labour’s front bench in protest against its lack of commitment to the EU, then became foreign secretary when this was remedied. Later, after his party turned against the EU once again, he resigned to help set up the Social Democratic Party. He has always been a forceful critic of what he calls the “chauvinistic and unrealistic” idea that Britain can, or should, act alone.

So when he declares, now, that it’s time to leave the European Union, then his reasons are worth listening to. This is not the war cry of a Little Englander or a starry-eyed attempt to draw the sword of British sovereignty from the stone of Brussels. Lord Owen has carefully weighed his own pro-European ideals against the hard lessons of recent history: contrasting what the EU says with what it does. Just because it aims to promote unity, it’s hard to ignore that its policies have brought sado-austerity, scandalously high unemployment and the rise of the far-Right. So Lord Owen has become part of a group that may well decide this referendum: Europhiles for Brexit. ...

[LondonManc]

They'd make a profit if they moved it anywhere.
It's spread out because of EU pork-barrel politics.
And anything by CB is usually bollox.

Nicely dismissive.

Freedom from the EU will give us free trade with the biggest economies of the world - China and Russia are both big investors in Brand Britain. Europe will still buy British products, while our fishing waters will stop being raped by Spanish fleets, giving our fishermen back their livelihoods. Brexit will also stop the EU dumping waste in our waters, give us back power over our Laws and governance and we will no longer be obligated to bail out failing countries.

That's without the billions saved by the NHS on health tourists and the child benefits paid out overseas to non-Brits where it is impossible to check for fraud.

If you want to stay in Europe, there are at least 15 Eurostar trains a day that you can catch. Bon voyage.

[sasguru]

2016-02-25 If the arch-Europhile Lord Owen wants out of the EU, it should make us all stop and think

Yes it's funny watching the lefties squirm on this topic.
On the one hand they've always supported the "brotherhood-of-man" aspect of the EU project, on the other they cannot possibly support the idea that countries should be competitive and live within their means and can't bring themselves to blame Greece for splurging cheap Euro money on pensions at 50, 13th month wages and a host of useless infrastructure projects.
Because of course austerity is always bad and you can print money as you like.
So they're torn. Makes me

[2uk]

Bottom line is all uk men will be stuck with porn and drinking. That is what you get for voting out of the only thing that matters most after feeding and secuirty needs.

There is no better proof of how mediocre english men have become... next time you go to tesco don't look at any of the hot thin chicks... coz soon you wont be able to.


And readig people here speak about loans and debts is like listening to mental institution patients.

[LondonManc]

Bottom line is all uk men will be stuck with porn and drinking. That is what you get for voting out of the only thing that matters most after feeding and secuirty needs.

There is no better proof of how mediocre english men have become... next time you go to tesco don't look at any of the hot thin chicks... coz soon you wont be able to.


And readig people here speak about loans and debts is like listening to mental institution patients.

Stuck with porn and drinking eh? What a shame.

[sasguru]

Nicely dismissive.

Freedom from the EU will give us free trade with the biggest economies of the world - China and Russia are both big investors in Brand Britain.

China has made it clear they want Britain to remain in the EC.
A market of 60 million isn't that worth bothering with.
Russia probably doesn't care if their dodgy money is safe.

Europe will still buy British products,

Trade will be on their terms as they did with Norway and Switzerland i.e. you'll have to follow Euro rules.

while our fishing waters will stop being raped by Spanish fleets, giving our fishermen back their livelihoods. Brexit will also stop the EU dumping waste in our waters,

Where does the EU dump waste in our waters?
I was under the impression that Britains beaches were filthy prior to EU laws.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/eart...standards.html

give us back power over our Laws and governance and we will no longer be obligated to bail out failing countries.

Which countries have we bailed out?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33532485

That's without the billions saved by the NHS on health tourists and the child benefits paid out overseas to non-Brits where it is impossible to check for fraud.

Health tourism is not a major problem, contrary to reports in the tabloids
https://fullfact.org/health/health-t...-and-who-pays/

If you want to stay in Europe, there are at least 15 Eurostar trains a day that you can catch. Bon voyage.

With my analytical skills, its true I can work almost anywhere in the world.
But if there's an outflow of clever people after Brexit for whatever reason, leaving people with your level of analytical skill (as displayed in this post) in the country, it's not going to thrive.

[sal]

That's without the billions saved by the NHS on health tourists and the child benefits paid out overseas to non-Brits where it is impossible to check for fraud.

But in most cases their parents are paying taxes and NI in UK, it's only fair to claim child support from the system you are contributing to. The number of cases where the parents are pure scroungers is negligent and disproportionate to the amount of attention this point is getting.

As for the health tourists, surely it's much easier to enforce better checks, than dealing with all the crap from leaving the EU. Not to mention that what comes around goes around, in the form of 500'000 UK ex-pats many of whom pensioners crippling the Spanish healthcare for instance

[Chuck]

next time you go to tesco don't look at any of the hot thin chicks...

I went to a Tesco once. It was full of fat ladies, with fat children, stuffing their trolleys with ready meals, fizzy drinks and crisps. Grotesque.

[DodgyAgent]

I've read it and don't understand why it matters. The people who architected the European Union conceived of it as a step-by-step progress to a single European state. And?

They did not. They were forced to make it a step by step process and it is also interesting to see the stealth tactics they used to push it through via Maastricht and the Lisbon treaty. I am not sure it is making a particular point with regards to the childish bickering that is kicking off here () but it is an interesting bit of history. Whether it is true or not would require some reading - which to be fair won't happen on CUK general as we prefer to make judgements based on our prejudices than make informed arguments.