Gordon Brown's legacy

[Doggy Styles]

I suppose to you that's the same thing, since you're incapable of believing anyone is genuinely left-wing except to take your money.

To be fair to dodgy there, it wasn't a case of right-wing v left-wing that you are trying to paint it as. It was showing Brown as more disingenuous.

[shaunbhoy]

Gordon Brown brought an end to the perennial cycle of boom and bust.
After he had been in charge we were only left with bust and bust.

[DodgyAgent]

To be fair to dodgy there, it wasn't a case of right-wing v left-wing that you are trying to paint it as. It was showing Brown as more disingenuous.

Yes.

I think the argument about left vs right is not the one we are discussing here

[d000hg]

I am afraid that until someone shows me an example of how socialism works to the benefit of the people rather than those who control its functions then that is precisely what I will always believe. It does not work, it never has and it never will.

I wasn't debating whether socialism works. I was debating whether you believe anyone else believes it works. You generally speak as if you think socialists know it won't work and can only be following the dogma for personal gain - e.g. you view everything through capitalist eyes.

To be fair to dodgy there, it wasn't a case of right-wing v left-wing that you are trying to paint it as. It was showing Brown as more disingenuous.

See above

[DodgyAgent]

I wasn't debating whether socialism works. I was debating whether you believe anyone else believes it works. You generally speak as if you think socialists know it won't work and can only be following the dogma for personal gain - e.g. you view everything through capitalist eyes.

See above

I am not arguing it from any sort of position other than from what I see in contemporary and past human behaviour. Very few human beings behave or think according to logic. Belief has little to do with practicality and logic. I am quite sure others believe that socialism is the way to make society work and they will argue their case convincingly I am sure.

[shaunbhoy]

I am quite sure others believe that socialism is the way to make society work and they will argue their case convincingly I am sure.

Yes, and it will all seem rosy right up until the point that they attempt to put it into practice..............at which point all the wheels generally fall off as human nature takes over.

[original PM]

But isn't the pinnacle of anyone's career in politics to become PM

And then once you have done that you should have to just fe<k off

[d000hg]

Yes, and it will all seem rosy right up until the point that they attempt to put it into practice..............at which point all the wheels generally fall off as human nature takes over.

Things would work much better without all these pesky people involved.

[Zero Liability]

I am not arguing it from any sort of position other than from what I see in contemporary and past human behaviour. Very few human beings behave or think according to logic. Belief has little to do with practicality and logic. I am quite sure others believe that socialism is the way to make society work and they will argue their case convincingly I am sure.

Especially since it involves forcing others into footing the bill. That said, irrespective of how many politicians genuinely believe what they espouse, I've little doubt Brown is a narcissist, and a very incompetent one at that. Some say sociopath - maybe. It doesn't alter the fact that whatever the provenance of his beliefs he's more than happy to stick others with the costs. And I have no doubt many 'leftist' politicians are little more than elitist technocrats, under the delusion that they and their bureaucrats know how everyone else ought to live, facilitated by their class warfare ideology and willingness to indulge the egos of supposed underclasses. Snake oil, plain and simple.

[SueEllen]

Especially since it involves forcing others into footing the bill. That said, irrespective of how many politicians genuinely believe what they espouse, I've little doubt Brown is a narcissist, and a very incompetent one at that. Some say sociopath - maybe. It doesn't alter the fact that whatever the provenance of his beliefs he's more than happy to stick others with the costs. And I have no doubt many 'leftist' politicians are little more than elitist technocrats, under the delusion that they and their bureaucrats know how everyone else ought to live, facilitated by their class warfare ideology and willingness to indulge the egos of supposed underclasses. Snake oil, plain and simple.

Sounds like all politicians regardless of whether they are left-wing, right-wing or centre.