Place your bets - 79% Of Scots Backing Yes

[Batcher]

In short does that mean that some taxes were raised rather than expenditure cut?

Some of it yes but other capital projects are cut or delayed as well. It's all about balancing the budget you have. Imagine what Westminster could do for our old folk if it didn't spend £millions on WMD or to countries for 'aid' who have WMD and space programmes?

The latest news from the new Forth crossing is that it's on schedule and below budget so some of the money has been moved to the dualling of the A9 which means it can start 6 months early.

I really believe that a smaller government with a fair representation through PR voting gives a much better result.

Have you seen the pictures of the Lords sleeping on the benches whilst getting paid £300 attendance money? Even more cronies have been installed, so many in fact that if they all turned up there wouldn't be enough room for them all. That's why some of them turn up, sign in for their £300 and bugger off again.

[TestMangler]

I understand how the grant is made up. I am just interested to know what you give up to get those freebies.



The quote is from the other Darling/Salmond thread. I think it was Testmangler that posted it. So, what do you guys give up to get the freebies?

Different areas are different Tractor.

The council tax freeze has hit councils, but in Labour controlled areas like Glasgow, they cut bin collections but maintain the fleet of Rolls Royces and the Lord Provost's catering budget.

In non labour areas (I live in Argyll & Bute) we've noticed very little.

TBH, the SNP appear to have done good things for the 'ordinary person' with the things listed in this thread that are 'free'.

Also, they have created a 100% grant for small business rates where the rateable value is £8K or less. I personally benefit from that as I own a shop.

That is the reason that I'm inclined to believe (or have more faith in) the words of the SNP. They have done things with a decreasing budget that the previous Labour administration couldn't. Ordinary people have seen the benefit.

I really don't know where the budgets were cut but it's certainly not anything that's visible to me in everyday life.

Some of the dumbass voters in Scotland would tulip a brick if they got a labour controlled Scottish government back and found themselves subject to 6 years of council tax rises.

[tractor]

...

Some of it yes but other capital projects are cut or delayed as well. It's all about balancing the budget you have. Imagine what Westminster could do for our old folk if it didn't spend £millions on WMD or to countries for 'aid' who have WMD and space programmes?

The latest news from the new Forth crossing is that it's on schedule and below budget so some of the money has been moved to the dualling of the A9 which means it can start 6 months early.

I really believe that a smaller government with a fair representation through PR voting gives a much better result.

Have you seen the pictures of the Lords sleeping on the benches whilst getting paid £300 attendance money? Even more cronies have been installed, so many in fact that if they all turned up there wouldn't be enough room for them all. That's why some of them turn up, sign in for their £300 and bugger off again.

I don't disagree with any of this. My questions weren't leading, I am genuinely interested.

Different areas are different Tractor.

The council tax freeze has hit councils, but in Labour controlled areas like Glasgow, they cut bin collections but maintain the fleet of Rolls Royces and the Lord Provost's catering budget.

In non labour areas (I live in Argyll & Bute) we've noticed very little.

TBH, the SNP appear to have done good things for the 'ordinary person' with the things listed in this thread that are 'free'.

Also, they have created a 100% grant for small business rates where the rateable value is £8K or less. I personally benefit from that as I own a shop.

That is the reason that I'm inclined to believe (or have more faith in) the words of the SNP. They have done things with a decreasing budget that the previous Labour administration couldn't. Ordinary people have seen the benefit.

I really don't know where the budgets were cut but it's certainly not anything that's visible to me in everyday life.

Some of the dumbass voters in Scotland would tulip a brick if they got a labour controlled Scottish government back and found themselves subject to 6 years of council tax rises.

Labour administrations could but wouldn't, that is the difference. It's the same with Tories and the Lib Dums really don't have a clue. It all makes perfect sense to me. The TV debates switched me off completely because they are just between educated idiots tbh. When I want to understand the effect of something, I always look at and speak to the people it affects most. I guess that comes form being a BA for so long. There is little point in listening to the people with self interest like salesmen, politicians, empire builders etc. That way you get a good understanding of the unintended consequences of poor or unresearched decisions.

Having contracted in local government yes, I have seen the appalling waste, incompetence and self indulgence.

It's such a shame that it comes to the point of independence to get these morons to actually listen to the people that vote them in and that are most affected by their decisions. Much of what is described would benefit this country, I'm not so sure about Trident because if we didn't have it the global balance would be quite different but that is another story, we could still afford it if we stopped subsidising developing countries dictators Rolls Royce collections with our international 'aid'.

Looks like I might have to vote 'Yes' then....oh wait! You aren't going to have immigration controls for us too are you? Please no? Seriously though, I might have to consider moving

One last point, how can you guys have a Scottish National Party and get away with it. We have a BNP and get slaughtered

[TestMangler]

I don't disagree with any of this. My questions weren't leading, I am genuinely interested.



Labour administrations could but wouldn't, that is the difference. It's the same with Tories and the Lib Dums really don't have a clue. It all makes perfect sense to me. The TV debates switched me off completely because they are just between educated idiots tbh. When I want to understand the effect of something, I always look at and speak to the people it affects most. I guess that comes form being a BA for so long. There is little point in listening to the people with self interest like salesmen, politicians, empire builders etc. That way you get a good understanding of the unintended consequences of poor or unresearched decisions.

Having contracted in local government yes, I have seen the appalling waste, incompetence and self indulgence.

It's such a shame that it comes to the point of independence to get these morons to actually listen to the people that vote them in and that are most affected by their decisions. Much of what is described would benefit this country, I'm not so sure about Trident because if we didn't have it the global balance would be quite different but that is another story, we could still afford it if we stopped subsidising developing countries dictators Rolls Royce collections with our international 'aid'.

Looks like I might have to vote 'Yes' then....oh wait! You aren't going to have immigration controls for us too are you? Please no? Seriously though, I might have to consider moving

One last point, how can you guys have a Scottish National Party and get away with it. We have a BNP and get slaughtered

I think Scotland is probably the only country in the world with a slightly left of centre 'National' party

A lot of SNP policy can be a bit lefty for my liking, but at the same time, they do have some sensible ideas when it comes to small business taxation and job creation.

The over riding thing for me is not the arguments about currency or jobs but that fact that the country should get the government it votes for, with full power to carry out the mandate of the people.

The Torys could come and shit in the kettles of everyone north of Scotch Corner and it wouldn't make one bit of difference to a UK election result. That's the first thing that needs addressed. The details can be worked out in the 18 months transition period. Labour and their overspending scum used to think winning an election in Scotland was a foregone conclusion. not any more !

[DodgyAgent]

I have never quite understood how people are persuaded by negative perceptions delivered by oponents in political arguments yet such tactics are considered a no no in the world of sales and commerce. to rubbish your competitor is a kiss of death in business yet we are taken in by it in politics.

most of the positives about the yes vote for Scotland are made as negatives about the status quo. This would not happen in business. suppliers are forced to focus on the positives of their own products and services. if they do not they fail.

This of course begs the question - if you are leaving the Uk because MPs are "out of touch" with your "needs" then what proof or evidence have you that things will get any better through change?

[TestMangler]

I have never quite understood how people are persuaded by negative perceptions delivered by oponents in political arguments yet such tactics are considered a no no in the world of sales and commerce. to rubbish your competitor is a kiss of death in business yet we are taken in by it in politics.

most of the positives about the yes vote for Scotland are made as negatives about the status quo. This would not happen in business. suppliers are forced to focus on the positives of their own products and services. if they do not they fail.

This of course begs the question - if you are leaving the Uk because MPs are "out of touch" with your "needs" then what proof or evidence have you that things will get any better through change?

For fuck sake Mr 20%

Learn to read, at least. Point out my 'negatives with the status quo' above, will you ?

I gave you a bunch of prime examples of positives brought to the masses by the SNP. They promised, they delivered, simple as that.

I left out any references to Cameron being a cunt and stuck to the facts (not that the Cameron fact isn't a fact ). What more do you want ??

[scooterscot]

most of the positives about the yes vote for Scotland are made as negatives about the status quo. This would not happen in business. suppliers are forced to focus on the positives of their own products and services. if they do not they fail.

This of course begs the question - if you are leaving the Uk because MPs are "out of touch" with your "needs" then what proof or evidence have you that things will get any better through change?

Where are the negatives here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbWnBX6BY5A

If your opinion is the result of mainstream media....

[Batcher]

I have never quite understood how people are persuaded by negative perceptions delivered by oponents in political arguments yet such tactics are considered a no no in the world of sales and commerce. to rubbish your competitor is a kiss of death in business yet we are taken in by it in politics.

most of the positives about the yes vote for Scotland are made as negatives about the status quo. This would not happen in business. suppliers are forced to focus on the positives of their own products and services. if they do not they fail.

This of course begs the question - if you are leaving the Uk because MPs are "out of touch" with your "needs" then what proof or evidence have you that things will get any better through change?

The people elected to the Scottish government need to represent their constituants better because the electorate can have a real say in the next election. The SNP have shown how it can be done and has improved the lives of many people in Scotland. They went from a few MSPs to a minority govt to a majority govt in three elections.

As TM says, the people of Scotland feel we can't influence anything that goes on in Westminster so we just end up feeling frustation and impotent as the Eton/Oxbridge boys club look after their own interests.

[scooterscot]

As TM says, the people of Scotland feel we can't influence anything that goes on in Westminster so we just end up feeling frustation and impotent as the Eton/Oxbridge boys club look after their own interests.

here here

"Mark "Rent-boy" Renton: It's tulipE being Scottish! We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the ******* Earth! The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some hate the English. I don't. They're just *******. We, on the other hand, are COLONIZED by *******. Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized BY. We're ruled by effete assholes. It's a tulipE state of affairs to be in, Tommy, and ALL the fresh air in the world won't make any ******* difference! "

[TestMangler]

The people elected to the Scottish government need to represent their constituants better because the electorate can have a real say in the next election. The SNP have shown how it can be done and has improved the lives of many people in Scotland. They went from a few MSPs to a minority govt to a majority govt in three elections.

As TM says, the people of Scotland feel we can't influence anything that goes on in Westminster so we just end up feeling frustation and impotent as the Eton/Oxbridge boys club look after their own interests.

Correct.

The 'Little Englanders' like Dodgy are usually first to scream about the ridiculous rules and laws made by the EU because you can't treat all these differing economies in the same way with the same rules. Well, same goes for the inside of the UK.