Public sector take it or leave it rate cuts are back, then

[mudskipper]

Is the current rate competitive? I think if it was a good rate I'd feel more inclined to accept the cut than if it was bottom end in the first place.

[northernladuk]

Is the current rate competitive? I think if it was a good rate I'd feel more inclined to accept the cut than if it was bottom end in the first place.

A very good point.. and to add to this... What have you got to go to? How long can you afford to be on the bench before it just wasn't worth leaving. With no guarantees of getting a gig and what rate it will be swallowing the cut has to be more attractive?

[tractor]

..

If you ask for a rate increase of 10% do you promise to work 110% as hard? This is the response of a petulant child.

You can do 94% of the work you do now, but then you'll be paid 94% of 94% of what you earn now.

No it's not! You shouldn't part quote really when it's obvious the first part of the second sentence is helpful to the point of the first. If you cut the notice to zero, it enables you to be more responsive when the next opportunity comes up. As for your first sentence rate increases are acceptable when the economy is in a period of inflation. That is a natural element of the economy and business.

I firmly believe commitment is a two way thing in business. The last part of the second sentence was tongue in cheek, I guess I forgot the emoticon to make it clear. Yes, many will take it on the chin and get on with it and I wouldn't cut my nose off to spite my face and leave. But first good opportunity comes along I would be off.

This is exactly the view they would take if you as a customer told them you were unilaterally cutting their fee by x% they would hold you to any contract to the point of going to court.

It would have been different if they had proposed cuts of any magnitude at renewal and IMHO that should have been the way to go.

[Verndale]

I've told my agent that ONS's relationship with them is their problem. My contract with the agency specifies a day rate for working on the client's site, so it's up to the agent to absorb the rate cut - I had nothing to do with the agent's negotiation about rates with the client - their margin, their risk.

I have no problem with the agent changing the rate at the end of the contract, that's life in a commercial world. Unilaterally changing the terms of the contract part way through is another thing. It's 6% this time, but what will the next breach be? An organisation that reneges on its promises once can hardly be trusted not to do so again.

I will be asking the agent under which terms of the contract will they be terminating our agreement - and why they think the clause(s) apply.

Personally I won't be staying, and nor will my colleague, there's plenty of jobs out there and at better rates. Cost to ONS? There's only two of us working on the project, it's high profile and will unquestionably be delayed by many weeks if we both depart. ONS will save about £2,000 + VAT on our costs. Draw your own conclusions as to whether or not anyone's though this through?

Something that has cropped up in this thread is that it would seem dishonorable to terminate your contract and walk away just because it's only a 6% cut. Wake up! The contractor will not be terminating the contract, the agent will. I'll be quite happy to fulfill my contract on the terms agreed.

[Scrag Meister]

Had rate cuts a couple of times not public sector though, usually a case of get looking for a new gig, and if not, remember that 94% of something is better than 100% of nothing.

Hope it works out well for you.

[psychocandy]

You are quite welcome to do it should market pressures come to bear. If you had to lose the house or demand a rate increase you would. Nothing stopping you do it.

I am sure they don't take these decisions lightly and thankfully it's very rare. It's not just contractors either, I am sure it is across all suppliers.

It is different, but so is the situation between being a supplier and being a client.

Be fair though NLUK. Imagine what you would do if a fellow contractor posted the following:-

"Half way through a 6 month gig. Client would be stuffed if I left so I've really got them over a barrel. Was thinking of sending them an email telling them to increase my rate by 10% or I'm off. What do you think?"

I would guess they'd get torn you shreds by you and your 'pack'?

[psychocandy]

I've told my agent that ONS's relationship with them is their problem. My contract with the agency specifies a day rate for working on the client's site, so it's up to the agent to absorb the rate cut - I had nothing to do with the agent's negotiation about rates with the client - their margin, their risk.

I have no problem with the agent changing the rate at the end of the contract, that's life in a commercial world. Unilaterally changing the terms of the contract part way through is another thing. It's 6% this time, but what will the next breach be? An organisation that reneges on its promises once can hardly be trusted not to do so again.

I will be asking the agent under which terms of the contract will they be terminating our agreement - and why they think the clause(s) apply.

Personally I won't be staying, and nor will my colleague, there's plenty of jobs out there and at better rates. Cost to ONS? There's only two of us working on the project, it's high profile and will unquestionably be delayed by many weeks if we both depart. ONS will save about £2,000 + VAT on our costs. Draw your own conclusions as to whether or not anyone's though this through?

Something that has cropped up in this thread is that it would seem dishonorable to terminate your contract and walk away just because it's only a 6% cut. Wake up! The contractor will not be terminating the contract, the agent will. I'll be quite happy to fulfill my contract on the terms agreed.

This is true. Clients relationship is with the agency, contractors is with agency so how can client insist contractor rate is cut?

Surely they should be having this discussion with the agency and then its up to the agency to deal with it as they see fit?

[northernladuk]

Be fair though NLUK. Imagine what you would do if a fellow contractor posted the following:-

"Half way through a 6 month gig. Client would be stuffed if I left so I've really got them over a barrel. Was thinking of sending them an email telling them to increase my rate by 10% or I'm off. What do you think?"

I would guess they'd get torn you shreds by you and your 'pack'?

Firstly that is just greed. Increasing a rate for greed is different to cutting rate to meet budget. Secondly it doesn't really matter what I think. This is an anonymous forum. If whoever said that wanted to do it then I would sincerely hope my opinion wouldn't stop him.
Thirdly, and most importantly, I don't have a pack. You need to understand this because as always you are trying to find the fault where there isn't any and avoid the obvious truth. My 'pack' are just a set of randoms who are vocal about what YOU post and YOUR posting style. It's nothing to do with a pack, and a leader or anything like that. They are pissed off at your posts. You are probably upsetting them more than me because they don't want to be associated with me. The only thing we have in common is being tired of you not thinking and posting all kinds of crap. Until you see that and understand the real problem nothing will change.

[SueEllen]

This is true. Clients relationship is with the agency, contractors is with agency so how can client insist contractor rate is cut?

Surely they should be having this discussion with the agency and then its up to the agency to deal with it as they see fit?

Depends if agency is on a fixed margin or not.

If the agency is on a fixed margin of 8-10% of your rate, and some who are the sole or one of the few on the PSL are on such low margins, then a 6% cut in your rate means they also get a cut.

[psychocandy]

Firstly that is just greed. Increasing a rate for greed is different to cutting rate to meet budget. Secondly it doesn't really matter what I think. This is an anonymous forum. If whoever said that wanted to do it then I would sincerely hope my opinion wouldn't stop him.
Thirdly, and most importantly, I don't have a pack. You need to understand this because as always you are trying to find the fault where there isn't any and avoid the obvious truth. My 'pack' are just a set of randoms who are vocal about what YOU post and YOUR posting style. It's nothing to do with a pack, and a leader or anything like that. They are pissed off at your posts. You are probably upsetting them more than me because they don't want to be associated with me. The only thing we have in common is being tired of you not thinking and posting all kinds of crap. Until you see that and understand the real problem nothing will change.

NLUK - If you or anyone else gets upset by, as you say, a random posting on an anonymous forum then don't you think its a bit weird?

And the 'pack' comment was meant a bit tongue in cheek. Sorry if it offended you.