Agreeing toT&C's by just applying for role?

**northernladuk** · 7 January 2013, 16:25

Opt in/out should be done before introduction to the client or starting work so it is too late for that by the time you sign. There is some ambiguity about it still being valid after introuduction due to the 'or before starting work' though.

I should think being made to agree to t&c's without being given the option to read them would be illegal and unenforceable and in any case you don't know what is gonna happen when you apply so I would just be sticking my CV in as normal and deal with that after. If you are really worried about it you could put a disclaimer line in your application saying you tentatively agree subject to being given a copy of the t&c's etc but I doubt it would be a show stopper.

Not knowing what they are though means we can't really comment on the implications.

**BolshieBastard** · 7 January 2013, 16:31

Originally posted by curtis View Post

I've noticed this lately on some job adverts mainly from the well known agency (similar to straw) that by just applying for the role you are agreeing to thier terms and conditions, no link of course to make it easy so you would have to search their website to find what t&C's relate. I have had a very quick look not found anything so don't know what exactly you would be signing up for.

I have never seem this before up until a short time ago, is this something new? I bet there is some opt/in out clause but how does any of this stand at just the applying stage and nothing has been signed? I take it if they call you rather than see the advert and you say yes I would like to be put forward for the role they will take that as verbal acceptance to their t&C's even though that way you would have been none the wiser of them.

It doesnt mean a thing regarding the contract terms and conditions.

If you are worried about opt in implications, just add in your email or covering letter with your cv that your co opts in and this supercedes any default position adopted by the agency or implied in the agency's T&C's.

**Antman** · 7 January 2013, 20:42

Originally posted by BolshieBastard View Post

It doesnt mean a thing regarding the contract terms and conditions.

If you are worried about opt in implications, just add in your email or covering letter with your cv that your co opts in and this supercedes any default position adopted by the agency or implied in the agency's T&C's.

I'm not sure what an agent would think in the cases where they read your email. They'd probably just delete your email and move onto the next one, too many CVs out there to be waste your time with some bolshie bastard.

I suspect that the statement agreeing to their T&Cs isn't worth a lot in the eyes of the law because you don't know what those T&Cs are when you send your CV in. I also think that if you got a role through them they'd send you the opt-out email, at which point you can refuse to play ball.

**kingcook** · 7 January 2013, 20:59

Play them at their own game. Apply for the gig via email, with a nice small link to your limited company's T&C

**Incognito** · 7 January 2013, 22:10

Depends what the Ts & Cs are saying. If it's bog standard usual stuff about how they hold your data etc it'll be fine. If it's exclusion type clauses restricting their liability then these need to be brought to your attention before entering the contract. Ts & Cs are enforceable even if not readily available, an example is buying a train ticket. You're entering a contract with the rail company agreeing to be bound by the conditions of carriage. The conditions of carriage will be found at a rail station or on the website, they're not printed on the ticket, instead you'll simply have reference to the conditions of carriage on it.

Enforcing the opt out is a no no, not only is it in breach of the regulations by removing your ability to choose, it's actually ineffective as you could then withdraw that notice prior to day 1 as per s.32.

(10) The person who is or would be supplied to carry out the work by a work-seeker which is a company, may withdraw a notice which was given in accordance with paragraph (9) by giving notice to the employment business or agency in question of the withdrawal of the earlier notice of agreement, and, subject to paragraph (11), paragraphs (1)-(8) shall thereupon apply.

(11) Where a notice as referred to in paragraphs (9) or (10) is given to an employment business or agency whilst the person who is or would be supplied to carry out the work by a work-seeker which is a company is in fact carrying out the work in a position with a hirer, then the notice shall not take effect until that person stops working in that position.

If it's done prior to starting day 1, the withdrawal is effective immediately.

**Wanderer** · 8 January 2013, 10:27

Originally posted by curtis View Post

if they call you rather than see the advert and you say yes I would like to be put forward for the role they will take that as verbal acceptance to their t&C's even though that way you would have been none the wiser of them.

I would guess that being put forward for an interview would be an Invitation to treat rather than the creation of a legally binding contract as there is no consideration (eg no payment agreed).

In other words, you have been invited to treat (enter into negotiations) with the agency (and the client as a third party). At this stage there is no consideration (payment) so no contractual relations have been formed. You would be free to reject the agency's terms and conditions and negotiate with them should your business see fit.

That's my view of it anyway - I'm not a lawyer though.

**Taita** · 8 January 2013, 16:28

Originally posted by BolshieBastard View Post

It doesnt mean a thing regarding the contract terms and conditions.

If you are worried about opt in implications, just add in your email or covering letter with your cv that your co opts in and this supercedes any default position adopted by the agency or implied in the agency's T&C's.

I am inclined to agree with the above. The terms and conditions referred to probably relate to the use of the website and authorise the site owner to use your details within the Data Protection laws and nothing more.

**Incognito** · 8 January 2013, 21:40

Originally posted by Wanderer View Post

I would guess that being put forward for an interview would be an Invitation to treat rather than the creation of a legally binding contract as there is no consideration (eg no payment agreed).

Consideration is a very open subject and is not necessarily of obvious value. It's not just a money based subject. You giving your CV across with them promising to submit it for a job can be tantamount to adequate consideration.

If I say I will mow your lawn in return for you letting me take the grass to use for my compost heap, then that is adequate to form the consideration for a contract.

Basically both parties must have given or promised 'something' in return for an item or promise.

You're right with your thoughts on the advertisement being an ITT, however I think the OP's Ts & Cs will be to do with what the agency do with the CV once they have it.

**kingcook** · 8 January 2013, 21:48

Maybe it's a modern day Clip joint

Agreeing toT&C's by just applying for role?