"We must opt you out of the Conduct of Employment Agencies Regs 2003...

[psychocandy]

Never had too much hassle with this. Current agency tried a few times to say I'd forgotten to send back the opt out form but in the end I gave up.

Always wondered, to save hassle, to just agree to opt out then send them a letter recorded delivery to arrive the day you start the gig withdrawing your opt out. I believe you can do that, can't you?

Cant seem them then phoning you telling you not to turn up at client....

[TestMangler]

My first contract gig was 18th Feb 2000. I've been contracting on and off since then, with some strategic permie posts in between, for almost thirteen years. What is your point caller?

My point is that, while you're a permmie, you're not a contractor, so you haven't been a contractor for 13 years.

But it's no skin off my nose. Feel free to lie to your agency all you want

[Gentile]

In conclusion, they've agreed to my not opting out.

Far be it from me to presume to advise anyone, but for any brand new contractors out there that are perhaps negotiating their first gig, if when you find yourself in a similar conversation with an agent, you'll know what to say. And you'll also "know" at least one person that's not opted out, even though your agent will claim never to have heard of such a thing in the whole history of contractors and contracting.

[Gentile]

My point is that, while you're a permmie, you're not a contractor, so you haven't been a contractor for 13 years.

But it's no skin off my nose. Feel free to lie to your agency all you want

Oh, I see. You were just arguing semantics and trolling for a reaction. Please, carry on...

[captainham]

Always wondered, to save hassle, to just agree to opt out then send them a letter recorded delivery to arrive the day you start the gig withdrawing your opt out. I believe you can do that, can't you?

My contract says you can opt back in once you have started...the opt-in is effective from the end of the existing contract, i.e. it's pointless to tell them I'm opting back in.

Being a sad pathetic newbie contractor, I didn't push the opt-in much at all, and to be honest I'm still on the fence about whether it is best to be in or out. For every article/comment I've read on it, there is an equivalent saying the opposite.

[stek]

My point is that, while you're a permmie, you're not a contractor, so you haven't been a contractor for 13 years.

But it's no skin off my nose. Feel free to lie to your agency all you want

I agree really, sort of - I started contracting in 1992, had a three year permie role WHF 2001-4 cos of massive personal issues, and one year 2010 because it just happened and I was tempted.

Four four years out of twenty means I am only a contractor for two years? Not sure about that but it doesn't matter, part of it for me is taking the permie bait when it suits and dumping it just the same when it doesn't.

The mindset for me, is still there....

[Gentile]

Never had too much hassle with this. Current agency tried a few times to say I'd forgotten to send back the opt out form but in the end I gave up.

Always wondered, to save hassle, to just agree to opt out then send them a letter recorded delivery to arrive the day you start the gig withdrawing your opt out. I believe you can do that, can't you?

Cant seem them then phoning you telling you not to turn up at client....

Yes, I think you could certainly do that. Whether it'd all hold up if it ever got to court is a philosophical imponderable at this juncture, unless anyone ever actually gets to that stage. What I can say from winning a court case in the past is that even when you win you lose, because it takes so much time and money and loss of earnings whilst you attend court to prove your case. Not to mention that you lose out on opportunities through the sheer hassle of the thing in the meantime: e.g., if there's ever a debate about the applicability of any restriction of trade clause should the end Client offer you a full-time job that you want to accept, the Client will back off as soon as the agency threatens to sue rather than trust your advice that your withdrawn opt out to the Regs 2003 should theoretically protect both of you.

I've found it best to avoid things even getting to court by making sure you're unambiguous in your dealings with people from the outset. It makes for a mildly more difficult conversation with the agent at the outset, but an easier relationship with all parties to the agreement in the long run. As I said to the agent in this case at the conclusion of our discussion, "OK, now we've got that out of the way, we can both get on with making some money and doing a good job for the Client. All this legalese is just the framework that allows that mutually-productive relationship to happen. Don't worry about timesheets, sick pay, or anything else: I assure you none of that is going to be a problem for any us." Once you've got the difficult conversations out of the way, it's always good to remind those you've had to negotiate with what the real objective of all this red tape is.

[NotAllThere]

Yes, you're right. I think the most appropriate title would be as you say. I need to watch my double-negatives. It's not opting out we are discussing here. Of course, there's no such thing as "opting in". And they'd be delighted for me to opt out.

I've fixed it for you... I think...

My point is that, while you're a permmie, you're not a contractor, so you haven't been a contractor for 13 years.

But it's no skin off my nose. Feel free to lie to your agency all you want

Don't drift off topic just to make some stupid trolling comment.

[Gentile]

I've fixed it for you... I think...

Thanks, NAT. But don't think that means I'm amenable to any Jimmy Savile -stylee high jinks with you.

[a3254643]

In conclusion, they've agreed to my not opting out.

Far be it from me to presume to advise anyone, but for any brand new contractors out there that are perhaps negotiating their first gig, if when you find yourself in a similar conversation with an agent, you'll know what to say. And you'll also "know" at least one person that's not opted out, even though your agent will claim never to have heard of such a thing in the whole history of contractors and contracting.

Just wanted to say thank you for your thread Gentile. I fall in to your target audience as someone just about to make the move from perm to contract.