Agency margins in "current climate" ...

[jmo21]

But our Ltd companies keep us at arms length. In the 21st C world of jobs boards I cannot understand why more companies don't advertise directly. It would be a small additional overhead for HR and would save the company thousands. If they want a plumber or a re-wire do they employ directly or go through a plumbers agency and pay a third extra? We are only 'commodities' after all.

By arms length, I was also including:

- not having their employee (Mr Development/Test/PM Team Manager) having to deal with a deluge of 100+ CV's (even more these days if you believe this forum)
- not having him having to chase round multiple people
- not having them bothered by prospective contractors calling him constantly

This "plumber" or any other labourer analogy just doesn't cut it for me.

For most IT roles (this is an IT forum after all, I can't speak for other industries), Mr Dev manager and HR couldn't give a toss if you are Ltd.

To them (most of them IMHO!) you are a bum on the seat doing the same work as the permies, no matter how much we protest that we are just a commodity etc

[jmo21]

here here!

It also creates issues and complications with regards to employment contracts. e.g. upper contractual issues not under the control of the contractor

Where where??

Why does the client care?

[hgllgh]

By arms length, I was also including:

- not having their employee (Mr Development/Test/PM Team Manager) having to deal with a deluge of 100+ CV's (even more these days if you believe this forum)
- not having him having to chase round multiple people
- not having them bothered by prospective contractors calling him constantly

Well HR should be doing much of this anyway and even if a company has no HR people then in the "current climate" maybe it would idea to spend a few minutes apply the same CV filtering that agents do, make a few calls and then they would be at the interview stage all without any agents being involved.

I dont think its that much of a burden, and if you're filling a role that will be taken for six months or more its really insignificant ... IMHO

[hgllgh]

Where where??

Why does the client care?

thats not the point. the point i was making is that having an additional contractual layer between the contractor and the end client can cause problems for the contractor (and possibly the client) in itself.

[Ruse]

As a recruiter, I think any MARGIN over 25% are outrageous especially in the contract world. (In this case we are dealing with a margin of 33.3% and a markup of 50%) whichever way you look at it is ludicrous in my opinion. The agency is laughing all the way to the bank with that one. As is the recruiter who is probably taking home c£220 a month just off that one contract.

Of course there is business development work which has gone on and it's extremely tough to gain new business in a dog-eat-dog market like recruitment, but for the work you put in on the actual recruitment side, margins of that amount are not justified in most, if any situation. Certainly not in the SW Engineering space and again, not in the contract world.

Jonathan
Morson International

Thank you ! At last some common sense on here and it comes from an agent rather than some of the so-called contractors posting tosh.

[Ruse]

If you believe the agencies get money for doing not a lot, then why don't you become an agent and undercut them, making slightly less than them for doing "not a lot".

PS - what do you want out of this? Legislation to fix/limit the margins of agencies? or just to force them to tell you.

Or is this just a "It's not fair" rant?

Now you are definitely an agency playing at being a contractor and tbh I couldn't find anything in your posting history to convince me otw.

[conned tractor]

Certainly not in the SW Engineering space and again, not in the contract world.

Jonathan
Morson International

I must say Morson were very good when I was with them. Not that we actually spoke much, but then we didn't need to and it was fine by me.

In fact, in spite my user name being chosen on the basis of my initiation into the world of some of these chancers, the last two contracts have been with really quite good agents.

I don't know what morson's margin was but could take a very good guess and was reaasonable. And the second agents margin was ridiculously low. I was so impressed with these two agents that I lmost started a thread on it but knowing this place thought better of it.

Its good to see an agent coming out of the closet though.

[pzz76077]

The very idea that you are not fully committed to a contract that you have signed up to sais a lot about your character and I have to say that you are not the sort of person that I would want to employ.
If I were your agent I would dump you now before you caused any further trouble.

There are plenty more where you came from - anyone can read a few books from Microsoft and operate a point and click development tool.
It seems that everyone thinks that the world owes them a living these days. If you had a PhD, hot C++ and were a master in algorithmic trading systems then you may have a case. However you are one step up from desktop support and there are thousands of your likes for every role that becomes available.
HTH

IMPORTANT NOTE: before anyone flames me or sends me any more PM's; Im not an agent, though I have recruited a lot of contractors over the years, so I guess that I am in the recruitment business.

PZZ

[Alf W]

My agency are on 10%. I wish they were on 50% as it would give me something to go for at renewal time.

[kaiser78]

As a recruiter, I think any MARGIN over 25% are outrageous especially in the contract world. (In this case we are dealing with a margin of 33.3% and a markup of 50%) whichever way you look at it is ludicrous in my opinion. The agency is laughing all the way to the bank with that one. As is the recruiter who is probably taking home c£220 a month just off that one contract.

Of course there is business development work which has gone on and it's extremely tough to gain new business in a dog-eat-dog market like recruitment, but for the work you put in on the actual recruitment side, margins of that amount are not justified in most, if any situation. Certainly not in the SW Engineering space and again, not in the contract world.

Jonathan
Morson International

This is an interesting posting.
By my calculations my agent is taking a margin of 20% and markup of 25%. I was going to look to negotiate this at my contract re-newal next month but it seems may not be such a bad deal after all ? Interesting.