Perm job - asked to pay for training courses attended upon handing in notice

[RichardCranium]

ICL some decades ago were generous with training, the downside was if you left within 36 months (24?) of a course, you compensated them on a sliding scale.

I thought that was a brilliant system - everyone wins. Employee gets training with minimal risk for the employer.

It never dawned on me that the sort of employee that would go on a course and then bugger off and leave, would go so far as then to wriggle out of their side of the deal.

I must be stupid and niaive me. I pay my bills.

[TheFaQQer]

£4000 is more than a couple of days' work.

Speak for yourself

[HairyArsedBloke]

This came up elsewhere in the mainstream press not so long ago, but I can’t find it now.

I was surprised to find out that it is perfectly legal to reclaim costs of training if the person leaves employment. Generally it is on a sliding scale i.e. 75% in the first year, 50% in the second, etc. It has to be in writing beforehand as well.

However, I must say that I am on the side of the employer on this one.

[shoes]

You might want to consider having them invoice your ltd and paying for it with pre-tax money to take the sting out of it a bit

[chicane]

Sorry? Could I just paraphrase that:
Despite freely entering into a clearly understood contract/situation I wonder if there is anyway I can wriggle and squirm my way out of it?
...
Could you PM me with your Company Details, Real Name etc - because I want to be sure I never have any dealings with you in the "outside world"

I bow down to your moral superiority - you clearly set an shining example that the rest of us can only aspire to.

Google is your friend: http://www.employment-solicitors.co....ining-fees.htm

Thanks - I couldn't seem to work out the correct combination of words to get something worthwhile from Google, but you seem to have hit the nail on the head.

Thanks also to everybody else for your thoughts on this.

[chicane]

It never dawned on me that the sort of employee that would go on a course and then bugger off and leave, would go so far as then to wriggle out of their side of the deal.

Hmm, people on this board are very judgemental today.

Put yourself in the shoes of Mrs. Chicane for a moment. What if part of the training repayment agreement you'd signed was actually unenforcable under employment law, such that (for example) your employer was only entitled to half of the cost of the training?

Would you still insist on paying the full amount, or would you use the law to protect you, and therefore only pay half the sum requested?

As it happens, the links that NotAllThere provided have already provided me with information on some things I need to check about the training repayment agreement Mrs. Chicane has signed. If, having researched the matter, I find the agreement to be wholly enforcable, then I agree it is her responsibility to pay the money requested.

However, if the employer has not been sufficiently diligent to ensure that their training repayment agreement complies with all relevant laws, they only have themselves to blame if Mrs. Chicane finds a way to pay either nothing or a portion of the repayment amount requested.

[Amiga500]

Stop being so ******* self-righteous and pedantic everyone, chicane is allowed to ask a question without you all jumping on your high horses like some big moral fairies.

[nomadd]

Put yourself in the shoes of Mrs. Chicane for a moment. What if part of the training repayment agreement you'd signed was actually unenforcable under employment law, such that (for example) your employer was only entitled to half of the cost of the training?

Would you still insist on paying the full amount, or would you use the law to protect you, and therefore only pay half the sum requested?

As it happens, the links that NotAllThere provided have already provided me with information on some things I need to check about the training repayment agreement Mrs. Chicane has signed. If, having researched the matter, I find the agreement to be wholly enforcable, then I agree it is her responsibility to pay the money requested.

However, if the employer has not been sufficiently diligent to ensure that their training repayment agreement complies with all relevant laws, they only have themselves to blame if Mrs. Chicane finds a way to pay either nothing or a portion of the repayment amount requested.

Agreed. But I think you really do need to take legal advice on this. Maybe the CAB is a good place to start as it's free; after that, just get a local solicitor to take a look - on the cheap - before you start spending too much on legal fees.

I had to introduce such a repayment scheme for a Bank I was contracting for a few years ago, as we had so many permies leave once we'd trained them. I used to do all their IT recruiting, and was told to make sure candidates understood the repayment/training situation right from the start.

I think you really need to tell us: 1) What was the EXACT job role your wife took on?; 2) Why did she require training? 3) What was the benefit to her, and what was the benefit to her employer.

I guess only in the case where you could clearly show that they offered a job that she clearly could NOT do WITHOUT the training would you have a case for reducing the training costs to her - i.e. it was Health & Safety related, training on specific systems ONLY of use whilst she worked for that particular company, etc. In other words, she was in effect OBLIGED to take the training as part of the job, whether she wanted to or not. Also, exactly how long was she in the job, and why did she leave? All of these items will have a bearing on the case.

As I say, gather the details and then seek proper legal advice.

Cheers,

Nomadd

[expat]

What happens if she withdraws her notice? Is she still liable to pay for the courses if they terminate her? If she says that she is willing to stay after all, that may let her out of paying for the courses, but they may prefer her not to stay unwillingly, and come to some arrangement.

But I have to say that I'm with the judgemental crew: if she didn't want to stay there, why did she take the courses under these conditions?

[EddieNambulous]

You could (undoubtably) play the "Big Corporation bullies poor innocent Mrs Chicane" angle in the local Press/Radio etc.

Having been a local hack in a former life, I don't see much newsworthy here...unless Mrs Chicane is locally well-known...and even then it's a just a mundane, boring legal dispute with a company.

Now, on the other hand, if Mrs Chicane were to, say, ride naked on a horse through Chicane-Town in protest...