30 days notice to agency?

[Turion]

Notice periods are not meaningless. The provide a framework for the ordered termination of a contract, before the specified end date. There can be legal comebacks if one party disregards it's obligations. More importantly, they have a moral significance. I would never sign a contract that gives the agency the right to cancel with no notice, whilst I could not give any notice.

As an example, my previous project was cancelled mid contract last summer, and they sent all contractors home, but still paid the weeks notice.

[The Lone Gunman]

Actually this notice period business really interests me. Just playing devil's advocate for a moment. Should a contractor have a notice period?

Stick with me on this...I had never given this much thought until I was talking with a client recently who does not expect contractors to have notice period i.e. they work through to the end of the agreed period. Now this client's angle on notice period was that like any other professional you employ for a set piece of work would not normally have a notice period for example a plumber, builder etc. If you enter into a contract with a builder to build you an extension you would expect him to complete the project as agreed. If he/she then gives you 4 weeks notice half way through the build - well it just wouldn't happen.

I just wondered if any one had any thoughts on this?

That is all well and good, but.....
We are not builders or plumbers. They have the advantage of knowing exactly what they will be doing before quoting and accepting the work, many of us don't. They will agree a fixed price, our clients wont.

When I take on a contract I have no intention of quitting early (unless there is a payment problem) so do not require a notice period. I would accept my client asking me to leave at a moments notice if they no longer require my services.

If I really want to quit I just tell the client I will be working on another project for a few weeks (which builders do to their clients) and wait for them to terminate.

[DodgyAgent]

Notice periods are ridiculous and meaningless.

As you are not paid when you are not working there is no point having a notice period.

What is to stop you giving notice and then saying you wont be in for 4 weeks? Or the client giving notice and then saying there is nothing for you to do so don't turn up?

Clients and agents alike want all kinds of protection clauses, many just want a short term employee but dont want the cost or commitment. We end up with dodgy contracts or no work.

The reason clients pay you spoilt brats so much money is that they can enjoy the flexibility of being able to get rid of you. As ever in the true spirit of "customer service" you dont seem to want to take any responsibility for giving the client some form of security. what is worse is that as soon as the Indian software companies come on the scene to give clients the security they want you all start whining and crying.

The difference between the Indians and some of you shower is that they understand the concept of service, you losers on the other hand look at the relationship between yourselves and the client as one of confrontational attrition.

[NotAllThere]

Well said.

By having a service orientation, by being flexible, by being very very skilled, I've converted a 2 day a week 3 month contract into 3 years of continuous billing (except when i take my frequent holidays ).

[The Lone Gunman]

The reason clients pay you spoilt brats so much money is that they can enjoy the flexibility of being able to get rid of you. As ever in the true spirit of "customer service" you dont seem to want to take any responsibility for giving the client some form of security. what is worse is that as soon as the Indian software companies come on the scene to give clients the security they want you all start whining and crying.

The difference between the Indians and some of you shower is that they understand the concept of service, you losers on the other hand look at the relationship between yourselves and the client as one of confrontational attrition.

You are replying to the wrong bloke dodgy. Read my last post as to my attitude to customer service. I never take on a contract I do not intend to complete and the client can drop me on the spot if they wish.

The client still has an employee mind set (often prompted by agents) and so puts employee like terms in the contract. This has a knock on for me with IR35 etc.

The clients often want employees without having to go through the red tape of employing them and then having to lay them off.

[DodgyAgent]

You are replying to the wrong bloke dodgy. Read my last post as to my attitude to customer service. I never take on a contract I do not intend to complete and the client can drop me on the spot if they wish.

The client still has an employee mind set (often prompted by agents) and so puts employee like terms in the contract. This has a knock on for me with IR35 etc.

The clients often want employees without having to go through the red tape of employing them and then having to lay them off.

Fair enough. However there is nothing wrong with a client wanting to take on a contractor because it saves them red tape hassle. Both parties know the score and contractors are paid a premium to allow for this.

[The Lone Gunman]

Fair enough. However there is nothing wrong with a client wanting to take on a contractor because it saves them red tape hassle. Both parties know the score and contractors are paid a premium to allow for this.

We are almost in agreement here too. Nothing wrong with wanting to avoid the red tape, but the premium paid falls far short for these circumstances.
If the clients would admit at the start that this is what they are doing then we would all know our IR35 status and could set a comensurate rate.
You know as well as I do that the client bases the rate on a B2B basis but wants us to work on an employee basis. The client wants to avoid both the responsibility and the tax bill but doesnt want to pay for the tax bill side of it.

This is one of the reasons IR35 is there and is unfair.

[rb621]

There's plenty of examples were things go bad and other things are handled sensibly. Common sense does prevail in most situations.

I currently have to give 3 months notice but the client can give me 1 month - it's a 12 month gig. I would have preferred it to be equal but the client prefers no surprises and can plan for the long term. I had a choice to accept it or not.

But the reality is certainly different! In the past I finished a project 6 weeks ahead of schedule and was then given 1 weeks notice although my contract had a 1 month notice period. Not worth pushing it financially to claim back 3 weeks money, but hey - I wouldn't have wanted to sit around doing nothing for 4 more weeks.

That's the nature of the game - we offer flexibility for a reasonable reward.

The reason clients pay you spoilt brats so much money is that they can enjoy the flexibility of being able to get rid of you. As ever in the true spirit of "customer service" you dont seem to want to take any responsibility for giving the client some form of security. what is worse is that as soon as the Indian software companies come on the scene to give clients the security they want you all start whining and crying.

The difference between the Indians and some of you shower is that they understand the concept of service, you losers on the other hand look at the relationship between yourselves and the client as one of confrontational attrition.

[DodgyAgent]

In the past I finished a project 6 weeks ahead of schedule and was then given 1 weeks notice although my contract had a 1 month notice period. .

Had you not discovered CUK.com ?

[Turion]

There's plenty of examples were things go bad and other things are handled sensibly. Common sense does prevail in most situations.

I currently have to give 3 months notice but the client can give me 1 month - it's a 12 month gig. I would have preferred it to be equal but the client prefers no surprises and can plan for the long term. I had a choice to accept it or not.

But the reality is certainly different! In the past I finished a project 6 weeks ahead of schedule and was then given 1 weeks notice although my contract had a 1 month notice period. Not worth pushing it financially to claim back 3 weeks money, but hey - I wouldn't have wanted to sit around doing nothing for 4 more weeks.

That's the nature of the game - we offer flexibility for a reasonable reward.

That sounds like an IR35 caught contract as you had a lot of obligation to the client. You must be on a low rate to say that 3 weeks non-payment is not worth pursuing. As a business I aim to collect every penny owed (not literally) and I would not let an agency/client do that without a fight.

I don't care about contrators who are happy for clients to p1ss over them, what bothers me is the contagious effect, such behaviour has on clients if it is successful. It simply encourages them to do it.