A practical test for a contractor?

[pmeswani]

The thing you forget to mention is the time and cost overhead of taking on contractors and subsequently getting rid of them when they're found to be inadequately skilled.

The technical test at current ClientCo weeds out 9 of every 10 candidates - can you imagine the hassle of taking on and discarding 9 contractors for every one that meets the standard? Especially in a large organisation like this that's swamped in red tape for every hire/fire.

Absolutely agree. I am honest but brief on my CV and when asked what I know, I will tell them specifics of my knowledge on a certain product. Blind faith is not always a good idea... for both the contractor and the client. I don't have a problem thinking like a contractor, and want to make sure that my best interests are met.

[expat]

...there is usually more than one answer available to me so that's never the problem, identifying the solution that takes the least amount of time/money is what wins.

At a tech level, yes. At a more abstract level, identifying the problem properly is what really wins.

It's part of my problem with tech tests: they can test the tech keywords on my CV (all are 100% honest), but that's just my toolkit, not my job.

[malvolio]

The thing you forget to mention is the time and cost overhead of taking on contractors and subsequently getting rid of them when they're found to be inadequately skilled.

The technical test at current ClientCo weeds out 9 of every 10 candidates - can you imagine the hassle of taking on and discarding 9 contractors for every one that meets the standard? Especially in a large organisation like this that's swamped in red tape for every hire/fire.

OK, but that's a process failure then. Clearly if they need to trim applicants to that extent, they need to change the way they find them.

At its most basic, taking on a contractor via an agency is easy - "Start Monday". Sacking them is even easier "The door is over there". If it's more complex than that, then someone - probably Human Remains - is padding their own job at your expense.

OK, in the real world you have a point, and some organisations have complex requirements. Doesn't mean we shouldn't keep pushing the basic mantra.

[ratewhore]

Never taken a test and, more importantly, I would never agree to take a test. If that means losing a gig then so be it. I'm a contractor ffs!!

[kanulondon]

I gave a test to spme 'so called' Java Developers for a Permie role once.

Out of 5 applicants, only 1 passed

And that wasn't even a good pass, this was all really basic stuff as well. I think for a technical role tests (whether verbal or written) are sometimes called for.


Out of interest Fish...what sort of test were they?

KL

[fishtastic]

Out of interest Fish...what sort of test were they?

KL

The position was for a Hyperion Admin, I don't know if you've met the product, but the test was some very simple tasks in Essbase.

Build a dimension from a file, load in data, input a formula and create a filter.

I personally, was worried that it was far too easy (I still think it was very easy) and was expecting to really grill them after that, to find out the depth of their knowledge.

A similar thing happen a few months ago for a SQL Server Developer position, permie this time. I set a test. Make an appropriate table for some data (in Enterprise Manager, I didn't even make them type it out in Query Analyzer), use a DTS to import text file into table and do some transforms on the data (add leading zeros 234 becomes 000234 and 2234 become 002234, concatenate 2 columns, write a case statement and take a space and 2 characters off a column of names which had varying lengths).

We tested some candidates one had 7 years SQL experience, Admin then developer, one had 5 years, neither could do it. I was embarrassed for them, they both said what they were asked to do was very easy but they hadn't done X or Y for a few months despite their CV saying their last job was SQL Server Development.

Fish

[BolshieBastard]

I wouldn't give anyone ~£300 a day (he wanted more than that) without see if they could actually do the kind of work required.

Am I the odd one for setting a practically test???

Fish

Yes and why the **** do you expect me to take a test? I've got ISEB \ ISTQ qualification. That's the 'test' I sat not some poxy 15 questions you dream up off the top of your head.

I refused to take a 'spelling' test for one education oriented client based in Stockport. Why? Because if there are any words I have difficulty spelling, I use a pocket dictionary or spell checker.

The client was a bit taken aback and said they had to make sure that words were spelt correctly. I said they were supposed to be hiring my co for my technical expertise not spelling ability which I said was very good already thank you and, if needed, I'd use a pocket dictionary.

Blurts!

[NickFitz]

I first must apologise for posting on the wrong forum, I guess this should have been general but I had both open when I was reading and I posted to the wrong one. Ooops.

If you had posted this in General you would have just got a load of irrelevant wittering about immigrants or gypsies or something, and some random jokes about fish, so you probably did the right thing

I've found that many people who've looked fantastic on paper, done lots of contracts and have a broad experience of IT solutions seem to have little practical knowledge of the platforms they claim to have used. A classic is 'I haven't used this for a while, but I'd be fine after a day or two' for a product they had said they were using until 2 weeks ago when their previous contract finished.

I do expect are certain amount of exaggeration on a CV or from a recruiter but people seem to think they can put anything down and as long as they know the keywords from a book about it that the contract is theirs.

I'm not trying to be snarky, but some people seem to think that a person who has experience of using a technology must, by definition, understand how that technology is used the way their organisation uses it. You should test people on their general ability with a technology, not on their ability to use it the way you do.

For example, most PHP developers have never used the Symfony framework. However, you can test their general understanding of programming, and of the PHP platform - if they can show a good understanding thereof, they can be productive on Symfony in a couple of days. Conversely, they could display a good surface knowledge of Symfony, yet prove to be utterly useless as developers.

I'd look for honesty - nobody knows it all. When I was interviewed by a client whose name begins with "Y" and ends with "!" last year, I faced some of the most enjoyable (by which I mean toughest) questions I've ever had at interview. I was more than happy to say "I don't know, but I can find out by looking at..." to some of them, and this was accepted as a professional response. Being willing to learn, and knowing how to find out, is very important.

Somebody knowing how to do things in the same way they've always been done won't add anything. But if that's all you need, somebody who's keen on learning and adapting is better to have around than somebody who only knows that one way - especially if that one way has subtle variations from your version of that one way.

[Turion]

Fishtastic and the other testerholics on this thread sound like jealous permies anxious justify their miserable existance. They do this by setting 'tests' that 90% fail. Of course they themselves pass with ease (only cos they made the test in the first place ) Then armed with the results they can moan about the miserable state of contractor knowledge and the cheek them demanding 300pd when they know nothing.

Get a life you toads, and stop wasting valuable contractor time. Some of us have to take time off only to be confonted with a snide trying to trip us up. Choose an efficient way of picking candidates (try using the telephone) and then use the time saved to do productive work (if you know what that is)

In my case, 6 yrs ago, after encountering similar ballpats, wasting time and money, now only do telephone interviews. Never been a problem finding work, though I'm in a niche market which helps.

[jim2406]

i'm a developer. have no problem at all doing a short practical test.

the last 2 interviews (succesful) i've had, both at major organisations (major bank and NHS) have both had practical tests. NHS was a working interview, paid, with an aim to start proper work the next day.

with other disciplines it may be harder but with a developer its obvious within 15 minutes of sitting someone in front of an IDE if they know what they're doing.