Contracting in The Hague (Netherlands)?

[Turion]

So, you are in fact saying then that a person can work up to (180/4) 45 weeks a year in NL and stay in the UK tax system? Is this a general thing in the EU? It puts an entirely different spin on working in the EU if this is the case. I generally work 44 weeks a year and have turned down EU work in the past due to tax complications around the 183 day rules. Thanks.

Yes that's right. You can work Ltd, 10 months on the Mon-Fri commute, as long as you do not give them an excuse for deeming you resident. If you go back to your permanent resident, do not open bank accounts, long term rental leases and any other residenty stuff you're fine. Agencies like Fuxley, and Regressive won't listen though, and will quote endless speel about compliance (they won't mention their kickbacks from the Mgt Co's they push). Problem is it's not just NL now. This contaigion is spreading to other countries. Today I had one spouting off about needing to use a German Payroll for a 3 monther in Munich! Cos it might get extended and to ensure you pay you taxes like a good boy. Just say no is the simple advice.

I suspect many IR35 adverse contractors in the UK, just roll over and accept the nonsence they get told by the agencies. It is the agencies and not the clients who are causing the problems. Going direct is the best solution, although there are many agents who will accept Ltd Co operation. Vote with your feet.

[Jubber]

Yes that's right. You can work Ltd, 10 months on the Mon-Fri commute.

Good luck with finding an agency that will do that. I know the agencies that were used on my gig wouldn't do it.

What they are frightened about is the scenario if you get another 6 month gig in Holland with another agency/client after their 3 month gig has finished and you swan off with all the cash and have broken the 183 day rule. Then the agency and the client and everyone in the 'chain' are liable for your uncollected taxes for that tax year (as I understand it).

[Turion]

Good luck with finding an agency that will do that. I know the agencies that were used on my gig wouldn't do it.

What they are frightened about is the scenario if you get another 6 month gig in Holland with another agency/client after their 3 month gig has finished and you swan off with all the cash and have broken the 183 day rule. Then the agency and the client and everyone in the 'chain' are liable for your uncollected taxes for that tax year (as I understand it).

Two gigs with different agencies would not be detectable by authorities unless you told them. The problem is agencies are trying to mitigate the minimal risk of investigation and even more minimal risk of tax penalties (for someone who gets deemed resident) by imposing a one size fits all solution which ignores the non-resident contractor. [Don't forget, they also get £££ large kickbacks from the mgt co they recommend].

It would be good if the PGC could come up with something. In the meantime ignore agencies that impose such solutions. The more they hear the 'no' word the more likely they are to change their ways

[Jubber]

I understood that the problem was with the client I was working for, not the agency. Basically the client told the agencies only to hire those who pay tax through Dutch Limited companies, or are willing to. If you are lucky enough to find a gig where the client is ignorant of the chain law or is willing to take the risk then great, fill your boots.

But on the other hand, I earned plenty, lived very well, lived in Amsterdam for a year (that is a delight in itself) and the experience brought on further contract work. I wish you luck as I would love to go back again.

J

[kismet110]

^^^

Thanks agains guys for the posts, very informative. They initially wanted me to go over there for a face-to-face next week but I've persuaded the pimpette an initial telephone interview is a pre-requisite (!) and they've agreed to this so set for today.

The 'idea' of working in The Netherlands does appeal to me after years of daily grind in the City/CW but at least now if it does progress I know what to ask regards the logistics.

EDIT: couple more q's for those who have worked over there please; how much is accomodation (B&B type I guess, or maybe a large room in a flat?) and food/drinks? I'm sure it'll be cheaper than London ....

[tim123]

So, you are in fact saying then that a person can work up to (180/4) 45 weeks a year in NL and stay in the UK tax system? Is this a general thing in the EU? It puts an entirely different spin on working in the EU if this is the case. I generally work 44 weeks a year and have turned down EU work in the past due to tax complications around the 183 day rules. Thanks.

No it's not a general thing.

I'm just about to leave Sweden after less than 6 months and they will recognise a rule like this.

However, the Germans most definately do not.

Never worked in NL so I don't know what they do.

tim

[Turion]

No it's not a general thing.

I'm just about to leave Sweden after less than 6 months and they will recognise a rule like this.

However, the Germans most definately do not.


tim

They do if you go home every weekend / and or spend some of the time remote working. There is significant a difference between being phyically resident (like living there continuously for 6 months, taking long term rental leases >3 mnths, and opening local bank accounts) and being a travelling consultant who returns to his permanent residence and family each week. Doing this there is no problem at all with the German tax gestapo. Done it for 6+ months with Ltd Co. Some agencies can have a problem with this, and I avoid those that do.

[Fred Bloggs]

Thanks for the clarifications. Next time I'm offered a good deal in NL, France or Germany I might just be tempted for 8 or 9 months. With the £ melting against the Euro, 800 Euro's a day is a fairly good deal I reckon.

[tim123]

They do if you go home every weekend / and or spend some of the time remote working. There is significant a difference between being phyically resident (like living there continuously for 6 months, taking long term rental leases >3 mnths, and opening local bank accounts) and being a travelling consultant who returns to his permanent residence and family each week. Doing this there is no problem at all with the German tax gestapo. Done it for 6+ months with Ltd Co. Some agencies can have a problem with this, and I avoid those that do.

No, The Germans apply their lesser form of tax residency for simply being present.

They will (in theory) apply full tax residency as soon as you take on an apartment rental.

The fact that someone has got away with not self declaring their residency status does not mean that it is the correct thing to do

tim

[Fred Bloggs]

No, The Germans apply their lesser form of tax residency for simply being present.

They will (in theory) apply full tax residency as soon as you take on an apartment rental.

The fact that someone has got away with not self declaring their residency status does not mean that it is the correct thing to do

tim

So, staying 4 nights a week in a B&B is OK?