Another contract v perm thread

[MyUserName]

350 a day is only 350 a day when you have worked that day. Salary is paid regardless.
When you are perm the work hours and commute are not going to change every few months.
There is a host of fringe benefits that come with being perm.
HMRC are going to keep getting more and more aggressive with IR35

Go perm, at least for a few years.

[Ld1978]

Thanks everyone - definitely food for thought. My eldest starts school in sept and youngest is 18 months soon so when I say experiences i mean like the holiday we just had, doing Disney in a couple of years (I’ll need that long to save ha ha) our day our at peppa pig. All the nice stuff at weekends which I may not be as easily able to do. I know spending time is key too but the commute right now is only 30 mins extra than the perm job and most roles I would imagine could be done in an hour. Would I be gaining that much time?

But on the flip there’s the guaranteed salary but all the perm crap too. A friend of mine has contracted for 25 years in Pmo and rarely had no work (a couple of times) I appreciate the market has changed though.

I kind of got thrown into this through redundancy.

What age did you think with going back to contracting? Do you not find with perm roles sometimes they want even more hours and all that going the extra mile?

I’m just playing devils advocate to try and cover all angles - I don’t know why I’m finding it so hard

[Ld1978]

Also if IR35 reform hit private would they increase rates to encourage contractors?

[Glencky]

I think I'm in line with the thinking evidenced by most posters so far, and NLUK's made the important point that this isn't a one-time decision - go permie and you can make the decision to go contracting again ?? a year ?? or so down the line.

What's really surprising me is how resistant you are to it. Truly honestly, the money doesn't look that different to me once you take into account the benefits, holiday etc. Are you really that allergic to the 'permie crap'? If you're not a line manager, the overhead / annoyance in doing a once or twice annual performance review really isn't that big of a deal, is it? And it's down to you the extent to which you get drawn into e.g. office politics.

Are there other kinds of 'permie crap' I'm thinking of that you don't like? do you have an issue with the organisation after they made you redundant whilst pregnant?

Feels increasingly like a no-brainer to go permie for a while to me, so I'm just trying to unravel where the resistance comes from... maybe it's 'just' the psychological barrier of not being your own boss. I can understand that, it's one of the key reasons I continue to contract even though I choose to operate inside IR35 and hence with reduced financial benefit over permiedom. But if I had a much shorter commute and an hour a day extra with my kids (though I don't have any so I'm guessing!) then I think I'd feel differently..

[Ld1978]

I think I'm in line with the thinking evidenced by most posters so far, and NLUK's made the important point that this isn't a one-time decision - go permie and you can make the decision to go contracting again ?? a year ?? or so down the line.

What's really surprising me is how resistant you are to it. Truly honestly, the money doesn't look that different to me once you take into account the benefits, holiday etc. Are you really that allergic to the 'permie crap'? If you're not a line manager, the overhead / annoyance in doing a once or twice annual performance review really isn't that big of a deal, is it? And it's down to you the extent to which you get drawn into e.g. office politics.

Are there other kinds of 'permie crap' I'm thinking of that you don't like? do you have an issue with the organisation after they made you redundant whilst pregnant?

Feels increasingly like a no-brainer to go permie for a while to me, so I'm just trying to unravel where the resistance comes from... maybe it's 'just' the psychological barrier of not being your own boss. I can understand that, it's one of the key reasons I continue to contract even though I choose to operate inside IR35 and hence with reduced financial benefit over permiedom. But if I had a much shorter commute and an hour a day extra with my kids (though I don't have any so I'm guessing!) then I think I'd feel differently..

I think it’s just the times I’ve contracted (this time and the last time and experience from others I know) is that contracting allows freedom of where to work, when (to a degree) and also it’s more of a your there to do a job and get on with it. Whereas most perm places I’ve worked are mad on development, going the extra mile and less about coming in and doing a good job (think pigex for appraisals time - they have to have a certain percentage in each. Eg someone who is the bottom end of good gets shifted into poor to make the numbers thus affecting bonus, moving in the company, perception etc) definitely not the organisation as I really enjoyed working for them hence why it would be one of the places I would go back to as perm.

I guess right now the contract I am in offers me time with the kids as it’s flexible and all the contract perks but obviously who knows what’s next.

I could also stick with this contract until it ends then weigh up my options although would I regret not taking this one.

Hope it makes sense as tapping on my phone which isn’t displaying the whole page

[fiisch]

I was in a similar position last year - 3 month old daughter, contracting close to home and was then offered a permanent role at same company with a very good salary. With a young baby at home and a hugely convenient commute, I decided to take the "safe" option and go permanent.

A year down the line, I am regretting that decision. I can't say for certain that remaining a contractor would have been better, but I am totally with you on all the permie admin rubbish that is involved, and personally I think that 18 months - 2 years is plenty long enough with the same employer. I also miss the tax benefits of being a contractor - particularly if you are looking at Higher Rate tax as a permie, you do feel significantly worse off financially, even if you don't need to keep quite the same level of safety net as if you are a contractor.

If I had to make the decision again, I'd stay a contractor - even if it meant a longer commute - but I think it's a very personal choice, and whichever you make, you will inevitably one day look back and think what if of the other option!!

[Ld1978]

I was in a similar position last year - 3 month old daughter, contracting close to home and was then offered a permanent role at same company with a very good salary. With a young baby at home and a hugely convenient commute, I decided to take the "safe" option and go permanent.

A year down the line, I am regretting that decision. I can't say for certain that remaining a contractor would have been better, but I am totally with you on all the permie admin rubbish that is involved, and personally I think that 18 months - 2 years is plenty long enough with the same employer. I also miss the tax benefits of being a contractor - particularly if you are looking at Higher Rate tax as a permie, you do feel significantly worse off financially, even if you don't need to keep quite the same level of safety net as if you are a contractor.

If I had to make the decision again, I'd stay a contractor - even if it meant a longer commute - but I think it's a very personal choice, and whichever you make, you will inevitably one day look back and think what if of the other option!!

Your so right - whatever I choose I will wonder what if. The girls are getting older now and I’m lucky grandparents do childcare which allows me flexibility.

I think having such a good contract right now isn’t helping the decision as I’m reallt enjoying where I am with no stress. I can’t say the same for the perm job as I think there will be more pressure

[northernladuk]

Can't think that way about contracts. They all come to an end and there are some really crappy ones out there.

[LondonManc]

Also if IR35 reform hit private would they increase rates to encourage contractors?

Why would they increase rates?

[Ld1978]

Oh yeah there are crappy contract and crappy perm but contract sort of feels easier to move on if it doesnt suit (funds allowing)

I just wondered if IR35 reform hits and its not as profitable for people that companies may increase to entice contractors back (I think I read something vaguely similar)

I am still back and forwards on it today ha ha. I have always been useless at decisions and no doubt will regret which ever way I choose.

It just feels right now I am in a good contract (the agency have already been there a year) and I am sure with my experience and network (and good central location to London, Newbury, Reading, Basingstoke, Southampton) I would find contracts that allowed me to be home in good time (market allowing of course). I know there is a risk but I have all my Ltd Company up and running and its a hard call whether to see what happens if the contracting dry's up. Is it worth asking my accountant or will he say stick contracting?