Advice on best way to ask for rate increase...

[BrilloPad]

It still begs the question - is it bad form to let the agent know that I know what cut they are taking when\if I start negotiations? Is it helpful or counter-productive?

The hiring manager here is also very approachable so I was wondering whether to ask him if he knows whether they are on a fixed rate before mentioning anything?

Personal I would leave hiring manager out of it. Initially.

I would say nothing to the agent until they say they are not sure if the end client can pay more. Then point out you know the end client does not need to pay more.

If it all gets agreed the check with end client. The agent might have negotiated more money without you knowing.

[jmo21]

Another guy I knew there got told the day before he started - sorry client budget has been cut. £50 less per day sorry. So he sucked it up.
Found out months later client hadnt said a word so agent had been sticking the £50 in his pocket. Borderline fraudulent and client was a bit put out but its not their money they were losing so agent managed to blag his way out of it.

If this ever happens to anyone, you've got the name of your interviewer(s), just say "Oh right, that's not great. John Smith never mentioned this at the interview, I'll give him a phone/email and find out what the story is. Maybe they might consider dropping my hours in return, or letting me do 2 days from home" etc.

"Or, John Smith just connected with me on LinkedIn, I'll send him a message and tell him I'm sorry but I won't be able to take the role at that rate".

Must have been a daft client though. Why should they be paying that £50 extra for a resource who accepted less?

It's business of course, but if I found out an agent did that as the client, I'd be doing my best to get them off the PSL.

[northernladuk]

Interested if anyone has had their agency bring out an argument to justify their margin that involved how much it cost them to borrow the money needed to pay contractors before they themselves got paid? (i.e they pay monthly for all invoices receded up to the week before regardless of when they get paid by thinned client)

This got trotted out by mine after 6 months when I enquired about a rate raise by them dropping their margin which is around the 15-16% mark.

I didn't want to move at the time so didn't make a big thing of it but it seemed like a strange argument. I'm personally not bothered if they moved me to 60 days payment terms if it meant I got them to drop their cut.

Anyone else seen this?

No because I don't think many agents believe their contractors are so stupid they would fall for it. They have to do the factoring, it's part of their business. If an agent is having to borrow large sums of money to pay their contractors I would be seriously worried about their cashflow!!

Maybe some idiot at the client is refusing to pay the agent.......

[rootsnall]

Quote the numbers to the agent, but they won't think 20% is excessive, so I'd be surprised if they don't go to the client manager for more to cover your increase. I'd defo talk to the friendly client manager in advance. A decent sounding place and possible repeat work, is 5% worth the walk !? Every day you are on the bench will take a month to recover at 5%. Tulip client then a different story.

[psychocandy]

Thanks All

I shall give this all due consideration and before saying anything, I will make sure that I am willing to walk if I don't hear the answer I want. I believe I am easily worth what I want - both skills and role wise. I thought originally that perhaps the client was just one of those clients that don't pay as much as the big boys, but now I know they do actually pay the right money it's just the agent takes the big cut, it changes my view somewhat. Especially as I think there could be plenty of repeat work.

It still begs the question - is it bad form to let the agent know that I know what cut they are taking when\if I start negotiations? Is it helpful or counter-productive?

The hiring manager here is also very approachable so I was wondering whether to ask him if he knows whether they are on a fixed rate before mentioning anything?

£64K question - tell agency you know the cut or keep it secret to use against them :-)

Hiring manager hmmm. I've had that when agency was taking a huge cut and lied to all parties. Client initially showed a bit of concern but then got bored and wasnt interested.

[psychocandy]

If this ever happens to anyone, you've got the name of your interviewer(s), just say "Oh right, that's not great. John Smith never mentioned this at the interview, I'll give him a phone/email and find out what the story is. Maybe they might consider dropping my hours in return, or letting me do 2 days from home" etc.

"Or, John Smith just connected with me on LinkedIn, I'll send him a message and tell him I'm sorry but I won't be able to take the role at that rate".

Must have been a daft client though. Why should they be paying that £50 extra for a resource who accepted less?

It's business of course, but if I found out an agent did that as the client, I'd be doing my best to get them off the PSL.

They were. Big company contract sorted by another department. Got well rinsed by the agency IMHO.

[psychocandy]

Quote the numbers to the agent, but they won't think 20% is excessive, so I'd be surprised if they don't go to the client manager for more to cover your increase. I'd defo talk to the friendly client manager in advance. A decent sounding place and possible repeat work, is 5% worth the walk !? Every day you are on the bench will take a month to recover at 5%. Tulip client then a different story.

Nope. Wait until its 40% then you can moan.

[zippy.mini]

Quote the numbers to the agent, but they won't think 20% is excessive, so I'd be surprised if they don't go to the client manager for more to cover your increase. I'd defo talk to the friendly client manager in advance. A decent sounding place and possible repeat work, is 5% worth the walk !? Every day you are on the bench will take a month to recover at 5%. Tulip client then a different story.

Agreed and that's what I'm currently weighing up. Thank you. I guess I was just surprised that the margin was so high, so it's more the principle of the thing. The more I think about it (with all your help ) the more I'm wondering if it's worth rocking the boat.

I will actually have to walk in a few months anyway unless they get me on an SC role as I want to keep my clearance current...

[SlipTheJab]

No because I don't think many agents believe their contractors are so stupid they would fall for it. They have to do the factoring, it's part of their business. If an agent is having to borrow large sums of money to pay their contractors I would be seriously worried about their cashflow!!

Maybe some idiot at the client is refusing to pay the agent.......

[TechJinx]

Maybe some idiot at the client is refusing to pay the agent.......

cross thread comedy - like it