+10%

[WTFH]

However I do wish people would stop rewriting history to get advantage in the modern world.

Do you mean to say you are happy to agree that JRM, BoJo, Arron Banks etc are re-writing the last 3 years to re-define what they said, while relying on the poor memory of their followers?

[Old Greg]

As we abolished a trade as old as time (one of the first countries to do so) and risked British lives enforcing it so yes I do believe it was a positive end, as the Gentlemen abolishing it were devout I believe that was a Christian experience for them.

History of slavery - Wikipedia


But I do agree I wasn't around then, so I can't take responsibility for it. However I do wish people would stop rewriting history to get advantage in the modern world.

You wish people would stop rewriting history? Then tell us how many slaves do you think were transported by British ships or to British colonies. You wash over that and head straight to abolition.

[original PM]

You wish people would stop rewriting history? Then tell us how many slaves do you think were transported by British ships or to British colonies. You wash over that and head straight to abolition.

Slaves were bought from African slave traders on the 2000 year old African slave market.

But yeah fook it blame the white man.

[Old Greg]

Leaving aside that I haven't made any such inference (look it up in a dictionary), let's follow the argument.

You made a statement about the EU and Hitler Youth and I made a statement that the alignment of British fascists is against the EU not pro EU. There was no statement about the broader set of people who are against the EU. So can you see now how my statement isn't wrong? I'm being patient here and trying to help you.

Oh dear the feckwit is strong in this one!

Infer definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary




Inference definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary



I could of used imply but the dictionary does suggest its a common usage. keep with the prog grandad!

When you present one side of information in a bad way you do try to imply that it is the whole situation.

My reference to Hitler youth was to suggest the EU are tutoring the young to be faithful to the cause like Hitler & Stalin did. Whenever I talk to a young remainer they suggest we should remain but they are unable to tell me why.

You should have stopped off at the OED.

infer | Definition of infer in English by Oxford Dictionaries

infer
VERB
[WITH OBJECT]
Deduce or conclude (something) from evidence and reasoning rather than from explicit statements.

with clause ‘from these facts we can infer that crime has been increasing’
More example sentencesSynonyms
Usage
There is a distinction in meaning between infer and imply. In the sentence the speaker implied that the General had been a traitor, implied means that the speaker subtly suggested that this man was a traitor (though nothing so explicit was actually stated). However, in we inferred from his words that the General had been a traitor, inferred means that something in the speaker's words enabled the listeners to deduce that the man was a traitor. The two words infer and imply can describe the same event, but from different angles. Use of infer to mean imply, as in are you inferring that I'm a liar? (instead of are you implying that I'm a liar?), is an extremely common error.

Aside from that, I made neither the implication or 'inference' that you suggest. My statement that British fascists are pro Brexit is not invalidated because there are left wingers who are pro Brexit. My statement was about fascists because it was within the context of your reference to Hitler Youth. That was the context.

In what way was my statement 'wrong'?

[Old Greg]

Leaving aside that I haven't made any such inference (look it up in a dictionary), let's follow the argument.

You made a statement about the EU and Hitler Youth and I made a statement that the alignment of British fascists is against the EU not pro EU. There was no statement about the broader set of people who are against the EU. So can you see now how my statement isn't wrong? I'm being patient here and trying to help you.

Oh dear the feckwit is strong in this one!

Infer definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary




Inference definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary



I could of used imply but the dictionary does suggest its a common usage. keep with the prog grandad!

When you present one side of information in a bad way you do try to imply that it is the whole situation.

My reference to Hitler youth was to suggest the EU are tutoring the young to be faithful to the cause like Hitler & Stalin did. Whenever I talk to a young remainer they suggest we should remain but they are unable to tell me why.

You should have stopped off at the OED.

infer | Definition of infer in English by Oxford Dictionaries

infer
VERB
[WITH OBJECT]
Deduce or conclude (something) from evidence and reasoning rather than from explicit statements.

with clause ‘from these facts we can infer that crime has been increasing’
More example sentencesSynonyms
Usage
There is a distinction in meaning between infer and imply. In the sentence the speaker implied that the General had been a traitor, implied means that the speaker subtly suggested that this man was a traitor (though nothing so explicit was actually stated). However, in we inferred from his words that the General had been a traitor, inferred means that something in the speaker's words enabled the listeners to deduce that the man was a traitor. The two words infer and imply can describe the same event, but from different angles. Use of infer to mean imply, as in are you inferring that I'm a liar? (instead of are you implying that I'm a liar?), is an extremely common error.

Aside from that, I made neither the implication or 'inference' that you suggest. My statement that British fascists are pro Brexit is not invalidated because there are left wingers who are pro Brexit. My statement was about fascists because it was within the context of your reference to Hitler Youth. That was the context.

In what way was my statement 'wrong'?

[Old Greg]

I'm sorry I missed the bit about gassing millions in UK history, we did do a bit of witchfinding at the Catholics request but nowhere near the Inquisition or genocide in Mexico. I did see some natural famines that the British attempted to alleviate its in the official documents but being a NoBrainer you won't read them.

I see feckwits trying to equate British Concentration camps (an idea we got from the US, Australians New Zealanders and Spanish where people were kept out of the fight by internment) with German Extermination camps where people were turned into corpses in their millions by Zyklon B.

I recognise our ancestors were brutal and exploited the natives but again I stress they didn't murder them en masse because that was bad for business, killing natives meant there was no one to tend the fields.

Do please identify a country the UK caused death intentionally on the same scale as the Germans or Japanese. Do supply your sources, make sure they are supported by legal documents not some axe grinding nutter's opinion.

Note naturally caused famines where the British attempted to alleviate the situation don't count. So that lets us off the Irish Potato famine where we tried to supply grain. The Indian famine in the war where Churchill supplied so much grain via lethal shipping lanes risking the war effort and British lives that there was enough for everyone to eat but corrupt locals stockpiled it, that was why Churchill was upset.

It is of course true that some people will exaggerate the brutality of British colonialism but that is no reason to deny the brutality through revisionism.

What is needed is an honest analysis.

vetran should read up on the Irish famine, particularly around food exports from Ireland. And then when there is an honest analysis, lay it out there, but don't take on any personal or group responsibility.

[Old Greg]

Final @ vetran:

Hope your head isn't too sore this morning.

[sasguru]

I operate fine I don't seem to need a minder to wipe the drool of my face or to leave the UK to find work like most remainers.

.

That's because you don't mind getting paid a pittance. You don't have the skills to go for the 100K+ jobs.

[sasguru]

Final @ vetran:

Hope your head isn't too sore this morning.

You ascribe it to drink rather than congenital stupidity? How very generous of you

[Mordac]

I'm sure you'll tell us next that forcing China to take our opium and starting 2 wars with them, ransacking their summer palace and killing untold numbers of locals was just a jolly little jape..

We may not have gassed millions like the Nazi Germans did, but our presence and influence in colonial territories directly resulted in millions of people dying. You can be in denial if you wish, but the facts and history are there for all to see. We were invading others countries, in the veiled disguise of commerce, and we didn't care who or how many died in the process.

That is not a uniquely British issue, the Spanish killed millions in Central and South America, the Dutch ransacked the East Indies, etc. Most of Africa was abused by the various European colonial powers who divided the continent between themselves. You could probably point the finger at the British for being the most "successful" in terms of global dominance and financial success, but in terms of brutality there's nowt between all of them. Judging historical events in terms of modern standards is a rather pointless exercise.
And just to correct you on one of your points, all of this was not done in "the veiled disguise of commerce", it was all blatantly and openly about commerce. We showed off the fruits of our conquests (see the Great Exhibition of 1851 as a prime example of many).