Post Brexit Travel to Europe

[PurpleGorilla]

Post Brexit Travel to Europe

Actually what it will do is make those places rely on tourism cheaper and therefore more people from those countries that are in the EU go there instead of the expensive UK. What the **** this has to do with Germany is anyone's guess, mind you if the UK hadn't been 'whinging Poms' for the past few decades it could have been them being the power broker in the EU, think about that. The only people to blame for all this, is the UK themselves

Sums up the inequality of nations in the EU.

[WTFH]

They are not doing this for the benefit of the citizens of the EU they are doing it for their own personal gain.

And that is what I find incredibly repulsive.

The same way I find it repulsive that you could replace EU with UK in your argument and the same would be true.
The UK leaving the EU is not for the benefit of UK citizens.
It is not to give us back sovereign control of our borders - we already had that, some EU countries are demonstrating it.
It is not to give £350 million a week to the NHS - that was a lie from the start
It is not to give UK jobs to UK workers - we are selling everything off to foreigners who offshore the jobs and the profits.

...and proof, if proof were needed, can be seen in how well the negotiations are going. It's not the EU's fault that the UK team can't negotiate, and the UK negotiators don't mind as long as the snowflakes continue to believe that it's the EU that is at fault for everything.

[BlasterBates]

They are not doing this for the benefit of the citizens of the EU they are doing it for their own personal gain.

And that is what I find incredibly repulsive.

You mean the "Eurocrats" who are appointed by their respective governments or the democratically elected MP's ?

You're argument simply underscores the need to for the UK disengage from the EU as the British clearly aren't mature enough to be in the EU. The UK government appoints the British Eurocrats, so if anyone is in it for personal gain then obviously the government is incompetent and the government was elected by the British people. If an MEP or his staff are in it for personal gain, and Nigel Farage is an example, then it is because British people voted them in.

At the end of the day if there is a problem, the British themselves are responsible and all you will do is replace Eurocrats and MEPs in it for personal gain, with Westminster MP's and Civil servants in it for their personal gain.

The problem has not been solved, because Boris Johnson and Michael Gove who are in it for personal gain are still running your country.

[original PM]

You mean the "Eurocrats" who are appointed by their respective governments or the democratically elected MP's ?

You're argument simply underscores the need to for the UK disengage from the EU as the British clearly aren't mature enough to be in the EU. The UK government appoints the British Eurocrats, so if anyone is in it for personal gain then obviously the government is incompetent and the government was elected by the British people. If an MEP or his staff are in it for personal gain, and Nigel Farage is an example, then it is because British people voted them in.

At the end of the day if there is a problem, the British themselves are responsible and all you will do is replace Eurocrats and MEPs in it for personal gain, with Westminster MP's and Civil servants in it for their personal gain.

The problem has not been solved, because Boris Johnson and Michael Gove who are in it for personal gain are still running your country.

The point I am trying to make is that we do not need the EU as a government style body more just a group of people using the economies of scale to obtain better/cleaner trade tariffs for those in the 'group'.

Unfortunately a country does need a government to function well and so yes we do have people within the UK government who are in it 'for themselves' however there are also lots of people working within the uk government who are just trying to do a good job.

However there is a general theme of people who wish to rule being naturally ego centric as they seem to be the people who have the drive to get those positions.

[SueEllen]

We harbour no desire to rule over Europe or the World - which is why we disbanded the Empire.

What a load of rot. It's not like the UK has a choice in disbanding their empire - a large war helped.

[BlasterBates]

The point I am trying to make is that we do not need the EU as a government style body more just a group of people using the economies of scale to obtain better/cleaner trade tariffs for those in the 'group'.

Unfortunately a country does need a government to function well and so yes we do have people within the UK government who are in it 'for themselves' however there are also lots of people working within the uk government who are just trying to do a good job.

However there is a general theme of people who wish to rule being naturally ego centric as they seem to be the people who have the drive to get those positions.

The European Parliament has the power to block all legislation they don't like or to sack the entire commission i.e. all Eurocrats. So it is all in the hands of the voters in the European elections if they think someone is in it for personal gain. In that respect it is no different to the UK parliamentary democracy.

[darmstadt]

The point I am trying to make is that we do not need the EU as a government style body more just a group of people using the economies of scale to obtain better/cleaner trade tariffs for those in the 'group'.

Unfortunately a country does need a government to function well and so yes we do have people within the UK government who are in it 'for themselves' however there are also lots of people working within the uk government who are just trying to do a good job.

However there is a general theme of people who wish to rule being naturally ego centric as they seem to be the people who have the drive to get those positions.

I think you'll find that not only is the EEA similar to the EU:

The EEA relies on the same "four freedoms" underpinning the European Single Market as does the European Union: the free movement of goods, persons, services, and capital among the EEA countries. Thus, the EEA countries that are not part of the EU enjoy free trade with the European Union. Also, '[t]he free movement of persons is one of the core rights guaranteed in the European Economic Area (EEA) ... [i]t is perhaps the most important right for individuals, as it gives citizens of the 31 EEA countries the opportunity to live, work, establish business and study in any of these countries

But that the UK is a member of a number of bodies from the UN, NATO, WTO, etc. which control much of how the UK operates in the wider world. Maybe the UK should leave all of those as well to have true 'sovereignty'?

[BlasterBates]

I think you'll find that not only is the EEA similar to the EU:



But that the UK is a member of a number of bodies from the UN, NATO, WTO, etc. which control much of how the UK operates in the wider world. Maybe the UK should leave all of those as well to have true 'sovereignty'?

Indeed, the UK has full control over:
Taxation and spending
Pensions and social benefits
Health
Education
Defence
The Criminal Justice system and police
Foreign Policy except for trade

What it doesn't have control over is trade, but then neither does Norway or Switzerland.

[billybiro]

Why would they allow that when 50% of the countries in the eu rely on British tourism to prop up their economy?

Or do facts not fit in with your bulltulip rhetoric?

Citation needed.

[WTFH]

Post Brexit Travel to Europe

Citation needed.

It depends on his definition of "prop up the economy", if it means "buy a beer in the country", then his figure may be true. If he means that UK tourists are responsible for more than half that country's income, then he must have some amazing stats tucked away somewhere.

Among the EU28, the UK is responsible for 23% of the personal nights stays made by EU28 nationals to other EU countries.
Source:
http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statist..._EU-28)_V2.png

Among the same countries, their income from tourism is not the backbone of the economy that some falsely believe it is:
http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statist...–15.png#file

Crunching those numbers, the UK is responsible for about €27,000million in tourism each year to the rest of the EU.
If the only country that UK people went to for a holiday was Spain, then yes, the UK would be responsible for about half of their tourism income. That would be roughly 1.5% of their GDP.
...but that only applies if all the UK money spent in Europe was only spent in Spain.

Averaging out the EU as a whole, the UK tourism receipts approx 0.2% of the EU GDP. If you take out the expenses behind those receipts, the figure is about 1/10th of that.