24 month rule and multiple contracts with different jobs (same client)

[Foxy Stoat]

Also, when I signed the new contract on my umbrella's internet site, there was a section where you are asked whether you have been with the previous client and how long for. I was honest and gave accurate dates. So if the umbrella company still lets me claim for expenses, then surely they must know what they are doing? After all, if it is 'wrong' then it is down to them to say so and stop me from doing it.

Either way, what's the worst that can happen now? Remember I haven't actually gone over 24 months yet, only in 'expectation'....which I had no idea about, earlier in the year (only started hearing about '24 month rules' about a month ago).

[malvolio]

Also, when I signed the new contract on my umbrella's internet site, there was a section where you are asked whether you have been with the previous client and how long for. I was honest and gave accurate dates. So if the umbrella company still lets me claim for expenses, then surely they must know what they are doing? After all, if it is 'wrong' then it is down to them to say so and stop me from doing it.

Either way, what's the worst that can happen now? Remember I haven't actually gone over 24 months yet, only in 'expectation'....which I had no idea about, earlier in the year (only started hearing about '24 month rules' about a month ago).

The rule appliles as soon as you know you'll be over 24 months. Sign a 2 year contract and you're caught from day one.

As for the worst that can happen - how does 100% of the back tax, plus 100% again as penalties, plus interest plus up to 6 years in jail for tax evasion sound?

This is not a game for amateurs. Learn the rules.

[Old Greg]

Also, when I signed the new contract on my umbrella's internet site, there was a section where you are asked whether you have been with the previous client and how long for. I was honest and gave accurate dates. So if the umbrella company still lets me claim for expenses, then surely they must know what they are doing? After all, if it is 'wrong' then it is down to them to say so and stop me from doing it.

Either way, what's the worst that can happen now? Remember I haven't actually gone over 24 months yet, only in 'expectation'....which I had no idea about, earlier in the year (only started hearing about '24 month rules' about a month ago).

IANAA.

Am I right in saying that the OP can still claim but has to pay BIK on it? Isn't that the answer now that he's actually made the claim?

[centurian]

So if the umbrella company still lets me claim for expenses, then surely they must know what they are doing? After all, if it is 'wrong' then it is down to them to say so and stop me from doing it.

Well they do know what they are doing - in particular they know that you are liable for the tax, not them. That's why they don't care too much if you get caught a few years down the line.

They provide a very basic check so HMRC can't acuse them of completely wilful neglect, but ultimately, it's your responsibility, not theirs.

Remember I haven't actually gone over 24 months yet, only in 'expectation'

Makes zero difference. It's expectation that counts, not reality. If you get canned tommorrow, you are still liable.

[Foxy Stoat]

I think a lot of this is scare-mongering nonsense. I haven't gone over 24 months, and besides which, from the start of this new 12 month contract at the end of March, well it's only July, we're talking only about 2 grand claimed in travel / subsistence. Peanuts. Frankly, I think tax people have got bigger fish to fry.

[Foxy Stoat]

The rule appliles as soon as you know you'll be over 24 months. Sign a 2 year contract and you're caught from day one.

As for the worst that can happen - how does 100% of the back tax, plus 100% again as penalties, plus interest plus up to 6 years in jail for tax evasion sound?

This is not a game for amateurs. Learn the rules.

That's a bit strong isn't it mate? I haven't wilfully tried to engage in 'tax evasion'. I've simply carried on doing exactly what I've been doing for the last 22 months, completely sanctioned by my umbrella company. The only reason I'm starting to ask questions about it, is because I read something about a '24 month rule' randomly on another website. No mention of this has been made by my umbrella company at any point. In fact they go out of their way to get you to constantly field expenses. They even tell you to try and put new laptops through, if you can!

Also what about 'my' expectation? I could say well actually no, I personally do not expect to stay longer than 24 months, regardless of contract length. That's actually quite true, because I've been wanting to leave my job for a few months now.

[Old Greg]

I think a lot of this is scare-mongering nonsense. I haven't gone over 24 months, and besides which, from the start of this new 12 month contract at the end of March, well it's only July, we're talking only about 2 grand claimed in travel / subsistence. Peanuts. Frankly, I think tax people have got bigger fish to fry.

So do the rules say it's ok as long as you've been there < 24 months?

[Foxy Stoat]

So do the rules say it's ok as long as you've been there < 24 months?

Well this is the thing, there is all this talk about 'expectation', but personally I think it's baloney. As long as you stick to no more than 24 months for the same client / location I personally don't think HMRC are frankly bothered. I have colleagues on 24 month contracts from the outset who claim expenses for that entire time. And then they stop. Mine is not even that, it has varied in length with long holidays during, and gaps in between renewals.

[Old Greg]

Well this is the thing, there is all this talk about 'expectation', but personally I think it's baloney. As long as you stick to no more than 24 months for the same client / location I personally don't think HMRC are frankly bothered. I have colleagues on 24 month contracts from the outset who claim expenses for that entire time. And then they stop. Mine is not even that, it has varied in length with long holidays during, and gaps in between renewals.

So what you're saying is that it's deliberate tax evasion but you should get away with it.

[jmo21]

Well this is the thing, there is all this talk about 'expectation', but personally I think it's baloney. As long as you stick to no more than 24 months for the same client / location I personally don't think HMRC are frankly bothered. I have colleagues on 24 month contracts from the outset who claim expenses for that entire time. And then they stop. Mine is not even that, it has varied in length with long holidays during, and gaps in between renewals.

Routine investigations happen. It doesn't matter what you 'think'.

How likely it is to happen to you (or your colleagues) is a different question.

And as for your 'baloney' comment. Try reading the examples on the HMRC website.

And let's hope you don't plan to argue with them about travelling to different places in London.