IPR Infringment?

[original PM]

Hi All,

I have a potential IP infrigment issue and was wondering if any could offer any advice.

The general situation is that in moving from one system to another we get a back up of the original systems databasees, stored proecedures etc so we could laod the old data into the new system.

We passed this onto a third party who was supplying the system to extract the data in useable format and load it into the new system.

The owner of the original system is not happy with this as he says there are stored procedures in the back up which could potential by used by the new supplier to enhance their product.

There is no intention of doing this as one of the main reasons why we are moving of the old system is that the new system is better and so we would not want the old code anyway.

Has anyone had an experience of this - does the original system owner need to prove the code has been stolen and used?

Any advice most appreciated.

Thanks

oPM

[eek]

Hi All,

I have a potential IP infrigment issue and was wondering if any could offer any advice.

The general situation is that in moving from one system to another we get a back up of the original systems databasees, stored proecedures etc so we could laod the old data into the new system.

We passed this onto a third party who was supplying the system to extract the data in useable format and load it into the new system.

The owner of the original system is not happy with this as he says there are stored procedures in the back up which could potential by used by the new supplier to enhance their product.

There is no intention of doing this as one of the main reasons why we are moving of the old system is that the new system is better and so we would not want the old code anyway.

Has anyone had an experience of this - does the original system owner need to prove the code has been stolen and used?

Any advice most appreciated.

Thanks

oPM

Yes, I've seen a case hit court before because the database table structure in system 1 looked like the database table structure in system 2 and 1 person working on system 2 had previously worked on system 1.

From memory the people who created system 1 won money from the people who created system 2. It wasn't a fortune but it was a significant sum.

[original PM]

thanks for the reply - but I assume therefore if we can prove the database tables/structure for the new company has not changed since they got their hands on the original suppliers database then it would be unlikely that any case could be bought?

[Scoobos]

From an IPR perspective, it depends on the wording in the contract.

Unfortunately though, in your scenario , if I was the dev I'd be starting legal proceedings . Whether the 3rd party uses it or not, it would appear that you've already divulged sensitive information which could be damaging and is probably in breach of IPR. (long sentance sorry!)

that said, you can try being open and honest with the guy and playing the accident card (which does admit a certain liability) - or even push that keeping the information in stored procedures on (I assume) a SQL server that the business owns gives it the right to duplicate the SP by default. (every backup will have a duplicate).

Tough one...

[eek]

thanks for the reply - but I assume therefore if we can prove the database tables/structure for the new company has not changed since they got their hands on the original suppliers database then it would be unlikely that any case could be bought?

In your case it could be worse. In the circumstances I outlined the information it was based on prior knowledge and a breakdown in communication.

In your case you seem to have provided a competitor with information well beyond what was required to do a data migration which I guess the original company was hoping to get. I'm not sure what the outcome is going to be but I doubt the original company is going to walk away without some cash or a trip to a court.

Sorry for not providing the news you want but I can't see any easy way out of the mess your in.

[AtW]

Don't admit any liability (this can invalidate your insurance), if necessary talk to a lawyer and check terms of your insurance because it is likely to require you tell them about any possible claims.

Good luck.

[TheFaQQer]

Has anyone had an experience of this - does the original system owner need to prove the code has been stolen and used?

He who asserts must prove.

However there is a historic case involving Lotus 123 and (I think) Borland where Lotus claimed infringement because Borland used the same menu structure as 123 used. I'd have to look up the exact case reference (hoping that my law database program which I last used in 1995 still works on XP!).

If I were the old company, then I'd be looking for some kind of settlement - the information provided to the new company seem to go beyond a normal data migration requirement. Take care and take decent legal advice.

[TheFaQQer]

He who asserts must prove.

However there is a historic case involving Lotus 123 and (I think) Borland where Lotus claimed infringement because Borland used the same menu structure as 123 used. I'd have to look up the exact case reference (hoping that my law database program which I last used in 1995 still works on XP!).

If I were the old company, then I'd be looking for some kind of settlement - the information provided to the new company seem to go beyond a normal data migration requirement. Take care and take decent legal advice.

The case I was thinking of was Lotus Development Corporation v Borland International Inc which is a US Supreme Court case - from an IPR perspective, it's interesting reading (especially since it ended up 4-4 with no verdict) about what can be claimed as a breach of copyright.