No To Retro Tax – Campaign Against Section 58 Finance Act 2008

[smalldog]

Try this petition instead

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petition...ion_invitation

This is just rotten to the core. IF this was anyone other than an MP, not only would they have to repay the money, there would no doubt be interest PLUS penalties and potential criminal proceedings. Pigs with their noses in the troughs again, Animal farm anyone?

Cameron must act or lose a significant amount of credibility and quickly!

[Fireship]

Try this petition instead

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petition...ion_invitation

Signed that one also with a suitable comment about government hypocrisy!!

[OnYourBikeGB]

Signed that one also with a suitable comment about government hypocrisy!!

Likewise, and pointed out that while moral repugnance seems to apply to everything between tax avoidance and food wastage, it doesn't seem to extend to cronyism verging on corruption when it comes to the Government. I doubt it'll make any difference, but it's good to vent.

[Incognito]

ok, thanks for the thoughts. Basically im best off in that case not flogging it at all and telling them to take it off me, then no CGT due. They can take a 2nd charge on it.

However I think its still quite an interesting one and not clear cut, if the crown takes an asset from you but you have to sell it first, does it raise CGT liability. I will be sure to ask HMRC when the time comes before deciding what to do, so for now I will sit on it. Selling it now generates a CGT liability guaranteed.

You may not want to consider this as I believe you are all still trying to be optimistic about this, but I think you should really start preparing yourself for how to deal with the worst if it comes to pass.

This link explains the enforcement action that HMRC can and does carry out with relation to unpaid taxes.

Enforcement action « TaxAid

I do not want to upset people, but as an external unaffected by this, I believe bankruptcy is the only option that HMRC will pursue if you are unable to pay.

Tax debt, bankruptcy and Special Relief « TaxAid

However, that does not mean that you cannot plan now for ways to mitigate any potential bankruptcy. You need to make sure you are in control at all stages, leaving it to the court appointed trustees (when in bankruptcy) will be the worst thing you can do. Whilst they have a duty of care to you to ensure they get the best value that they can, in practice it is impersonal and you will likely not realise the value of your assets that could be obtained by you dealing with the matter yourself.

If you have a second property, sell it when you think the market is strong and invest the income. Alternatively re-mortgage and take out all the equity when things are in your favour (good contract, good credit rating, etc) and then invest that equity. Make sure you are in control of extracting the value from your property. If you have a nice car, sell it now, buy a run about and invest the income. Don't let it be sold at a public auction where you won't see the true value. Of course, this is if you think you have the funds once everything has been sold to stave off bankruptcy, the alternative is to live the good life right up until the last minute.

Bankruptcy & Your Assets | Harrington Brooks

Another option, look at ways to protect your family home now. Trust law is a huge subject to go into, but if you follow the rules and set it up correctly you may be able to protect your family home.

http://www.cfrlaw.co.uk/fs/doc/artic...ive-trusts.pdf

Discretionary Trusts » Kew Law

What you need to do is speak to the experts and work out how to plan to defend yourself. In the best case, you win and have to unwind everything you have done to protect yourself. However, you need to plan now as everything you do will be scrutinised in bankruptcy and if not carried out correctly, will most likely be unwound by the court. You need to satisfy certain time limits and ensure you are acting above board. There are no insolvency proceedings at the moment, so any action would not be construed as being carried out to protect the assets from bankruptcy.

You really need to seek professional advice now, perhaps your action group could fund advice from an expert that could be promulgated to your members, then any individual could decide whether to pursue the extra cost in actually protecting their assets.

[growler]

Time to start living the good life! A miss is as good as a mile...

I think Invisible Touch was the group's undisputed masterpiece

[BeenGauked]

You may not want to consider this as I believe you are all still trying to be optimistic about this, but I think you should really start preparing yourself for how to deal with the worst if it comes to pass.

This link explains the enforcement action that HMRC can and does carry out with relation to unpaid taxes.

Enforcement action « TaxAid

I do not want to upset people, but as an external unaffected by this, I believe bankruptcy is the only option that HMRC will pursue if you are unable to pay.

Tax debt, bankruptcy and Special Relief « TaxAid

However, that does not mean that you cannot plan now for ways to mitigate any potential bankruptcy. You need to make sure you are in control at all stages, leaving it to the court appointed trustees (when in bankruptcy) will be the worst thing you can do. Whilst they have a duty of care to you to ensure they get the best value that they can, in practice it is impersonal and you will likely not realise the value of your assets that could be obtained by you dealing with the matter yourself.

If you have a second property, sell it when you think the market is strong and invest the income. Alternatively re-mortgage and take out all the equity when things are in your favour (good contract, good credit rating, etc) and then invest that equity. Make sure you are in control of extracting the value from your property. If you have a nice car, sell it now, buy a run about and invest the income. Don't let it be sold at a public auction where you won't see the true value. Of course, this is if you think you have the funds once everything has been sold to stave off bankruptcy, the alternative is to live the good life right up until the last minute.

Bankruptcy & Your Assets | Harrington Brooks

Another option, look at ways to protect your family home now. Trust law is a huge subject to go into, but if you follow the rules and set it up correctly you may be able to protect your family home.

http://www.cfrlaw.co.uk/fs/doc/artic...ive-trusts.pdf

Discretionary Trusts » Kew Law

What you need to do is speak to the experts and work out how to plan to defend yourself. In the best case, you win and have to unwind everything you have done to protect yourself. However, you need to plan now as everything you do will be scrutinised in bankruptcy and if not carried out correctly, will most likely be unwound by the court. You need to satisfy certain time limits and ensure you are acting above board. There are no insolvency proceedings at the moment, so any action would not be construed as being carried out to protect the assets from bankruptcy.

You really need to seek professional advice now, perhaps your action group could fund advice from an expert that could be promulgated to your members, then any individual could decide whether to pursue the extra cost in actually protecting their assets.

Very interesting post, Incognito. However, I always thought putting a house into trust or someone else's name would be seen as a "transfer at undervalue" if 5 years haven't elapsed. In which case, the whole transaction would be unwound by the bankruptcy courts?

[growler]

The court can unwind a transaction if it's under market value, but what about if one was to pay for goods and services? I.e. sell assets, get all cash together and then blow that. What are they going to do, tell Caeser's Palace in Vegas they have to hand all the cash back?

I think Invisible Touch was the group's undisputed masterpiece

[growler]

If you win, you might just avoid bankruptcy. It seems a no-brainer to me to try and pay our fair share of tax by investing it using our skill at the blackjack table.

I think Invisible Touch was the group's undisputed masterpiece

[BeenGauked]

If you win, you might just avoid bankruptcy. It seems a no-brainer to me to try and pay our fair share of tax by investing it using our skill at the blackjack table.

I think Invisible Touch was the group's undisputed masterpiece

Well, it's what the banks do, and the government don't have any problems with that.

[Fireship]

Very interesting post, Incognito. However, I always thought putting a house into trust or someone else's name would be seen as a "transfer at undervalue" if 5 years haven't elapsed. In which case, the whole transaction would be unwound by the bankruptcy courts?

Depends on the jurisdiction, have a quick look at the Statute of Elizabeth, long since repealed in the UK and replaced with updated versions such as the Insolvency Act….

Countries with laws founded in early English law tend to follow the principals laid down in the Statue of Elizabeth. Regardless the petition has to be filed in the appropriate country and some countries have specific criteria determining who can and can’t file!

Of course there are jurisdictions that are really tough on creditors seeking to set aside any transfer into trust, take a quick look at Nevis and St Kitts trust law for example….