BN66 - Court of Appeal and beyond

[SantaClaus]

Email and letter sent to Andy Love MP who is also on the treasury committee. Will attempt to see him at his surgery.

[deckster]

My understanding is this...

<...rehash of the Free Man of the Land principle...>

If there are any legal experts out there, I would welcome any comments on this.

As a cursory google will show, it's complete bollocks, eg Freemen of the dangerous nonsense « UK Human Rights Blog

[screwthis]

As a cursory google will show, it's complete bollocks, eg Freemen of the dangerous nonsense « UK Human Rights Blog

I agree that common sense would dictate that it is complete bollocks otherwise any laywer worth their salt would suggest this as a first line of defence.

The above article however doesn't disprove anything as it describes a case of car theft. My extremely limited understanding of Freeman on the land is that it while you do not cause harm or loss to another and while you never breach the peace you SHOULD (by Rights) never by accountble in a court.

The jury case descibed would fall under causing loss to another through theft.

After some cursory Googling of my own it seems that according to Freeman on the land, everything is a registered corporation; every Police Force, Magistrates Court, The House of Commons, every Council, every instrument of the State is a Registered Corporation. As such to control you they have to have a contract with you. No contract, no control.

So it would seem that your mortgage company can enfore reposession due to the contract but there is no contract between us and the tax authorities.

Not that I seriously think it will actually work. Seems too good to be true and a bit David Icke..

[cojak]

I think it appropriate to quote from the article:

These ideas are most attractive to desperate, vulnerable people who are going through terrible times in their lives. They are also classic conspiracy theories which should be consigned to the same category as the “9/11 was an inside job” T-Shirt which one of the debt advice website’s representatives is wearing in this YouTube video. The articles’ publication on CIF gives the ideas a veneer of respectability they do not deserve.

[Fireship]

Obviouslly I am grateful for MP and the fight they are taking on our behalf, but I also expect that they are fighting just for the all out win.

Is it also time to consider other angles and whether we try and reach one of the following scenarios.
Maybe parliament / HMRC / Gauke would be more applicable to a compromise.

The way I see it, there is 3 justifiable angles which we have decent grounds to complain about, and ask to be considered.

1) The interest penalties on Tax that was introduced retrospectively wiped out.

2) The same deal Suo Moto got

3) The ability to restucture our tax affairs based on us being Self Employed

If we were offered 1 & 3 or 1 & 2 I would accept this and move on??

Is it also time for asking Gauke to maybe consider this angle.
That way we are seen as still paying tax. The retrospective angle is in effect watered down, and I see it right now as a bit of a win/win situation for both us and Govt/HMRC.

MP would lose out though, and there is also the possibility that this would compromise the fight that MP are taking on our behalf.
I guess if MP agreed to fight for those sort of settlements in the end then that may suffice, but at that point it might be all too late and the revenue have no need or care for compromise and concessions?

Thoughts

As far as I’m concerned I’m holding out for all or nothing, I can’t afford any of the above options so I’m screwed either way, unless we win I’m bankrupt regardless of any deal cut with HMRC! My only hope is MP!

[Disgusted of Coventry]

As far as I’m concerned I’m holding out for all or nothing, I can’t afford any of the above options so I’m screwed either way, unless we win I’m bankrupt regardless of any deal cut with HMRC! My only hope is MP!

Would it help to point out that the Suo Moto Deal couldn't have been more than 1 or 2 years retrospection?

If this deal were to be faithfully re-applied, might that have to be a factor?

It could still be worth writing to your local MP.

[Dieselpower]

Letters

Toocan issued a brilliant call to action yesterday. It is IMPERATIVE that everybody spends 30 minutes of their time issuing letters to TSC, their MP etc. I have done my lengthy 3 letters last week, and also sent one to Gauke.

All we need to ask Gment to do is adjust the retrospective nature of S58 - our legal cases have been based on Human Rights issues - but what came out of them was the fact that S58 wasnt "clarification" but WAS retrospection. This point is key. We extracted a very helpful distinction. If the courts had ruled that S58 was merely clarification of previous law then we really would be in even bigger trouble.

We must now use that universally accepted fact to our advantage in our letters.

I strongly and kindly urge EVERYONE to send letters asap. There are countless occasions in history when action groups have succeeded. Think about it - we must all owe min £25k - how much is 30 minutes of our time worth???

[SantaClaus]

There is something else that everybody should be doing and that's beating a path to your MP's surgery door.

There's nothing like turning up in person to get some attention. Bring the kids and make it a family day out

[nevergiveup]

There is something else that everybody should be doing and that's beating a path to your MP's surgery door.

There's nothing like turning up in person to get some attention. Bring the kids and make it a family day out

I've asked for a meeting with my MP. He's written to the TSC and Mr Gauke and once he has a response he's going to see me and my wife.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

HMRC are sympathetic (not!)

This is taken from the witness statement of one of HMRC's investigating officers at the Judicial Review.

hmrc.jpg download