Loans from EBTs and other Trusts

[DonkeyRhubarb]

Don't panic

There's a huge difference between HMRC opening an enquiry and them being able to take any money off you.

I had my first enquiry into the BN66 scheme in November 2003 and they still haven't had a penny from me.

Let the scheme promoter deal with the tossers.

[rennarda]

I have also received a notice, backdated to 08/09. This in and of itself if not a major worry. The problem is I'm assuming they're also going to do the same for 09/10, 10/11 and 11/12 (after which I left the scheme and returned to running a ltd co).

I was using the scheme run by AML (Aston Management Ltd) - anybody else in the same situation ? I've not yet had chance to speak to them about this.

I find it baffling that the revenue can back date like this. It's just like them revising the tax free allowance limits, and then sending backdated tax demands as if that was always the limit in the past.

It's no exaggeration to say that if they pursue me for those years also, it will probably bankrupt me. Being bankrupt also disqualifies you from being a company director, which will put my current livelihood in jeopardy. If that happens, I'll have to sell the house - at which point I'll probably **** off and emigrate, taking my highly valued skills with me. What a brilliantly successful policy this will turn out to be.

Morons.

[Skyblue]

I have also received a notice, backdated to 08/09. This in and of itself if not a major worry. The problem is I'm assuming they're also going to do the same for 09/10, 10/11 and 11/12 (after which I left the scheme and returned to running a ltd co).

I was using the scheme run by AML (Aston Management Ltd) - anybody else in the same situation ? I've not yet had chance to speak to them about this.

I find it baffling that the revenue can back date like this. It's just like them revising the tax free allowance limits, and then sending backdated tax demands as if that was always the limit in the past.

It's no exaggeration to say that if they pursue me for those years also, it will probably bankrupt me. Being bankrupt also disqualifies you from being a company director, which will put my current livelihood in jeopardy. If that happens, I'll have to sell the house - at which point I'll probably **** off and emigrate, taking my highly valued skills with me. What a brilliantly successful policy this will turn out to be.

Morons.

its really crazy........killing the goose!!!
But I am sure when you get to talk to Aston it will be ok...

[sbakoola]

There's a huge difference between HMRC opening an enquiry and them being able to take any money off you.

I had my first enquiry into the BN66 scheme in November 2003 and they still haven't had a penny from me.

Let the scheme promoter deal with the tossers.

Indeed, have HMRC ever threatened anyone with jail time at a court case on these forums ?

[ChimpMaster]

Next step would be to get some independant advice from an accountant/tax firm.
The EBT saga is still ongoing.....HMRC lost the appeal against Rangers in Nov, but they have this week just been given leave to appeal to Upper Tribunal. It could be years before this is resolved through the courts.

But as I understand the legal position (case law) today is that no tax is due on loans. Obviously HMRC do not agree with this, are are trying to resolve queries by the settlement offer initially.

There's a huge difference between HMRC opening an enquiry and them being able to take any money off you.

I had my first enquiry into the BN66 scheme in November 2003 and they still haven't had a penny from me.

Let the scheme promoter deal with the tossers.

This is the problem (or going to be the problem) for a lot of people. The scheme provider will shut shop and disappear, leaving all individuals to have to deal independently with HMRC. Obviously it's much better for all if the provider has the decency to take on the HMRC challenge, but most will simply run off and leave contractors to defend themselves - which is a weak position to be in.

[cojak]

WCNS.

I'm afraid not all providers have the scruples of Montpellier.

As an open request. Could any grizzled BN66ers provide a starter 10 point (or so) bullet list for the shocked and naive newbies who do not have Montpellier to support them?

The usual caveats apply of course which I'll make explicit (WE ARE NOT LAWYERS, ACCOUNTANTS OR TAX SPECIALISTS - SO FIND ONE QUICK!).

But they seem to have no information or guidance at the moment and I'm genuinely not sure if your BN66 thread helps them.

Even an explanation agreeing or disagreeing with this would help, I'm sure.

So, without any experience, I'll start:

• WE ARE NOT LAWYERS, ACCOUNTANTS OR TAX SPECIALISTS - SO FIND ONE QUICK!
• Gather ALL of your documentation on the scheme, including ANY previous HMRC correspondence. Keep it safe.
• Find your provider - if they exist, they will be the best source of information and support.
• If they don't exist Google the names of those individuals who dealt with you from the provider
• ...
• Read the BN66 thread.
• Join No To Retrospective Tax (NTRT)
• ...

I'll copy into the OP and give credit if you do.

TIA.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

This is the problem (or going to be the problem) for a lot of people. The scheme provider will shut shop and disappear, leaving all individuals to have to deal independently with HMRC. Obviously it's much better for all if the provider has the decency to take on the HMRC challenge, but most will simply run off and leave contractors to defend themselves - which is a weak position to be in.

The enquiries HMRC are opening at the moment are merely protective in nature. They are not interested in individuals per se. As with BN66, they will be looking for a way to snare everyone in these loan type schemes in one fell swoop.

The only time you will know that they are serious about doing anything is if they start issuing Closure Notices to users of the scheme. Until then, enquiries mean nothing.

[cojak]

The enquiries HMRC are opening at the moment are merely protective in nature. They are not interested in individuals per se. As with BN66, they will be looking for a way to snare everyone in these loan type schemes in one fell swoop.

The only time you will know that they are serious about doing anything is if they start issuing Closure Notices to users of the scheme. Until then, enquiries mean nothing.

This info is exactly what I mean

[Waldorf]

I have also received a notice, backdated to 08/09. This in and of itself if not a major worry. The problem is I'm assuming they're also going to do the same for 09/10, 10/11 and 11/12 (after which I left the scheme and returned to running a ltd co).

I was using the scheme run by AML (Aston Management Ltd) - anybody else in the same situation ? I've not yet had chance to speak to them about this.

I find it baffling that the revenue can back date like this. It's just like them revising the tax free allowance limits, and then sending backdated tax demands as if that was always the limit in the past.

It's no exaggeration to say that if they pursue me for those years also, it will probably bankrupt me. Being bankrupt also disqualifies you from being a company director, which will put my current livelihood in jeopardy. If that happens, I'll have to sell the house - at which point I'll probably **** off and emigrate, taking my highly valued skills with me. What a brilliantly successful policy this will turn out to be.

Morons.

But your highly valued skills are of no use to the UK if you do not contribute towards the bills, ie you have paid no tax but expect the rest of us to help you out when you fall ill.

If you have spent all the money without holding any back for the inevitable day when HMRC come knocking, then it is your own fault.

Perhaps you should have looked into this before you signed up and got greedy.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

This info is exactly what I mean

I remember being worried when I got my first enquiry letter back in November 2003 into my 2001/2 return.

It is only natural to worry but the fact is HMRC will not pursue it further unless they stand a decent chance of winning a test/lead case in a tax tribunal.

HMRC want you to be scared because they will be hoping some people lose their bottle and throw in the towel. This is the only chance they've got of collecting any revenue without going to a tribunal.

There are thousands of people in these loan schemes and HMRC have a MASSIVE problem on their hands.