BN66 - JR Judgement Day

[Toocan]

Calm Down!

“What will happen now is that the tax demands will now become payable, up to the point that an appeal to yesterday’s ruling overturns them,” the firm said."

This implies that we'll have no ability to fend off HMRC, will have to pay up and will only get our money back if they lose a future appeal.

That is simply not true. The amount of tax that HMRC are proposing to charge you should be currently suspended pending an appeal on the closure notice. You can still demand a hearing in the tax courts. There is no point in HMRC being heavy handed on this - unless, that is, they want all 3,000 of us to demand a hearing.

We are on step one of the legal process - there is a whole staircase to go yet.

Please, stay clam.

[BolshieBastard]

My Barrister mate just phoned me. He's been looking over the judgement and had the following observation:

The judge may have done us a favour. It's no longer about 2500 embattled people, it's about the whole tax planning industry, the way tax legislation is drafted and enforced. He compared our situation to the Battle of Waterloo. We've been keeping a regimented square before yesterday. Now when it appeared we were outnumbered and outgunned the Prussian army comes into sight. Or as he put it, the entire tax planning system. So hold your nerve.

Even Wellington lost the first engagements.

His view is that we're no longer 2500 people, but a whole army with many more stakeholders than on Wednesday. It's just a question of whether they want to join forces or not.

He noted that the Judge played both sides of the coin when considering the legality of the scheme and Padmore. The judgement opens the door to a bigger challenge than just ours.

And I liked this:

"I didn't want you to go on holiday thinking there's just you and 2499 others facing the State. I think your ranks have just swollen out of all 'proportion'. It's just a question of getting the momentum going. Even marshalling troops to invade Iraq took more than 24hrs. Your fight has just spilled onto the streets."

So let's see who wants to join the fight.

I find your posts enlightening but, this is the same barrister friend who told you HMRC were up the creek without a paddle on the eve of the learned judge's decision, yes?

[warlord]

CTD question

CTD - question.
say you owe 35k (plus interest), have no savings now, but could paid into a CTD £600 a month, plus say a couple of 2K or more now and then. It will soon add up right?
Is this a possibility?

[Tax_shouldnt_be_taxing]

I find your posts enlightening but, this is the same barrister friend who told you HMRC were up the creek without a paddle on the eve of the learned judge's decision, yes?

Yep. The very same one. I don't divulge all conversations with friends in public, but I will share this with you. He's in employment law, not tax law but there are common threads. Contracts of employment come to mind. And his opinion was not related to the JR it was to the final logical reasoning and infers more than just an HR issue. I think there are many others starting to realise that this matter is less about BN66 now but rather the more far reaching implications of the judgement.

I think his view on what is now shall we say "in scope" is spot on.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

CTD - question.
say you owe 35k (plus interest), have no savings now, but could paid into a CTD £600 a month, plus say a couple of 2K or more now and then. It will soon add up right?
Is this a possibility?

Yes. Minimum initial deposit is £500. Minimum follow on payments are £250.

However...

If you haven't got any savings then you could take advantage of tax-free cash ISAs.

You can pay £5100 per year into a cash ISA from this April. If you have a partner, they can open one as well taking it up to £10,200 per year.

There is a table of cash ISA rates here:
http://moneyfacts.co.uk/compare/savi...nts/cash-isas/

I'm with Intelligent Finance, who are currently paying 2.5% on a cash ISA, and they have a good record of maintaining decent rates.

http://www.if.com/savings/cashisa.aspx

I think a lot of people are doing the right thing. Now is the time for a bit of forward planning because this could go on for another five years.

Make time work in your favour.

[Tax_shouldnt_be_taxing]

Yes. Minimum initial deposit is £500. Minimum follow on payments are £250.

However...

If you haven't got any savings then you could take advantage of tax-free cash ISAs.

You can pay £5100 per year into a cash ISA from this April. If you have a partner, they can open one as well taking it up to £10,200 per year.

There is a table of cash ISA rates here:
http://moneyfacts.co.uk/compare/savi...nts/cash-isas/

I'm with Intelligent Finance, who are currently paying 2.5% on a cash ISA, and they have a good record of maintaining decent rates.

http://www.if.com/savings/cashisa.aspx

I think a lot of people are doing the right thing. Now is the time for a bit of forward planning because this could go on for another five years.

Make time work in your favour.

A good point DR. It could go on for 5 years, so there are opportunities to set aside monies (maybe not for everyone and the amounts demanded will be relevant), but there is an opportunity to plan. Looking at my insurance policies, I'm worth more dead than alive (as my wife observed today...).

I read today that a bad debt which goes under debt management has interest frozen and an agreed repayment schedule planned. I wonder if HMRC work like the rest of the debt management industry?

[Lazylobster]

A good point DR. It could go on for 5 years, so there are opportunities to set aside monies (maybe not for everyone and the amounts demanded will be relevant), but there is an opportunity to plan. Looking at my insurance policies, I'm worth more dead than alive (as my wife observed today...).

I read today that a bad debt which goes under debt management has interest frozen and an agreed repayment schedule planned. I wonder if HMRC work like the rest of the debt management industry?

You don't want to go down the ISA route, as they may be legal tax arrangements now, but in in the future they retrospectively could not be ! I feel for all those poor souls who also had Tessa's . . . .

LL

[Tax_shouldnt_be_taxing]

You don't want to go down the ISA route, as they may be legal tax arrangements now, but in in the future they retrospectively could not be ! I feel for all those poor souls who also had Tessa's . . . .

LL

Tessa's . . . . what? I didn't think she was into that. Must have been a good night out!

[Lazylobster]

Tessa's . . . . what? I didn't think she was into that. Must have been a good night out!

The best, like it will be on the night when we get to a head (no pun) regarding this shocking episode.

[xantamisch]

I've cracked it!!

Yes - there's only one logical conclusion...............

I blame Mrs DR. In a fit of pique and panic that she'd have DR knocking about the house with nothing to do other than get in her way, she clearly tapped up the judge ....................... not that I am going to conjecture as to what she offered............

Obvious, innit!