EAA Regs / IR35

[MaryPoppins]

Ok Ok, so I can't seem to let this one go...!

But. Every single agency website that discusses the EAA Regs, states that opting in will affect IR35 status - they are not admitting to the threat of amending the contract if you opt in, but merely state that the very act of opting in is enough to bring you inside.

Of course I always assumed this is scare tactics designed to scare less informed contractors into opting out.

Is there any truth in it though? I have seen this sort of thing written on umbrella websites, too:

The regulations are designed to protect the worker from (unscrupulous) agencies and are written from that stance. If you are a business, then to seek protection given to workers does undermine your argument with the Revenue over IR35 status.

[TheFaQQer]

No. There is no IR35 impact from opting into the Agency regulations.

Any possible indicators that would put you inside are marginal at best, and a decent contract and matching working conditions would be the best thing.

There is a guide on the PCG website, which is probably more reliable than any agency / umbrella site.

Of course, if you are going through an umbrella, then it makes absolutely no difference, since IR35 can't apply.

[MaryPoppins]

No. There is no IR35 impact from opting into the Agency regulations.

Any possible indicators that would put you inside are marginal at best, and a decent contract and matching working conditions would be the best thing.

There is a guide on the PCG website, which is probably more reliable than any agency / umbrella site.

Of course, if you are going through an umbrella, then it makes absolutely no difference, since IR35 can't apply.

That's what I thought! (The umbrella bit).

I have literally started to question myself having done a bit of (loser) research and seen how many agency websites make this claim.

[TykeMerc]

No. There is no IR35 impact from opting into the Agency regulations.

Any possible indicators that would put you inside are marginal at best, and a decent contract and matching working conditions would be the best thing.

There is a guide on the PCG website, which is probably more reliable than any agency / umbrella site.

Of course, if you are going through an umbrella, then it makes absolutely no difference, since IR35 can't apply.

That's pretty much how I see it too.

[malvolio]

Take a look on my Blog: I did the 20 second guide to Opt Out reality recently...

[MaryPoppins]

Take a look on my Blog: I did the 20 second guide to Opt Out reality recently...

Ta. I know all of that, but am wondering how it is that every single agency appears to be able to get away with saying that we should opt out for IR35 reasons. I also agree that opting out makes much more sense for us in most cases, but I strongly, strongly resent being lied to and bullied into it by an agent.

[malvolio]

Because nobody ever challenges the agencies. Their view is that the point of introduction is the day you start work, which it isn't: that relies on a wrong interpretation of what the rules say. Doing it their way means they get contracts with much less restrictions on their own business without the downsides of an opted-in one. That won't change unless someone sues them for breach of opted-in conditions or someone shops the whole fiasco to DBERR. I'm not holding my breath for either one.

Let's face it, almost all the agencies are incompetent in the current market. They are stuffed with junior salesmen with no technical knowledge so they can't read CVs any more, they can't see transferable skills between industries, they don't understand the clearance rules, they have no real idea of the agency regs and they have no concept of us as independent businesses. In any other market, they would have gone to the wall years ago. No wonder the market is a total fsking mess.

There are other things in the pipeline that may change their approach but for now the best approach is to stay opted in by default and let them play their games. Ultimately, it's all pretty much irrelevant.

[TheFaQQer]

Their view is that the point of introduction is the day you start work, which it isn't: that relies on a wrong interpretation of what the rules say.

They don't seem to understand the word "either" in the clause which says that introduction is either when you start or when they know who you are. Every agent I have spoken to seems to think that this means that you can effectively choose what it means