Time to ditch PCG/IPSE?

[Ebenezer]

Having been called up for jury duty twice in three years when I was a permie, it's worth it for that alone as far as I'm concerned.

Add in the business interruption insurance, the cover if the agency / client go bust, the cover if the role falls through or isn't as described, the sickness cover - I just don't see where you'd get them all cheaper than £190 a year.

You may not need them, but personally I like to know that they are there if ever I did.

FWIW - if I was the subject of an IR35 investigation, I'd be talking to Qdos because their insurance covers me for all costs, whereas the IPSE+ membership only covers the cost of the investigation (no penalties etc.) But they aren't a like-for-like replacement.

Jury service twice in three years? You should start buying lottery tickets. Isn't it the case that most people are never called up? Anecdotally, I have heard of contractors getting out of it by pleading likely insolvency if they were forced to miss work for a fortnight.

I did see the line about "cover for £1000 if the role is not as described by the agent"; I thought that might have been included for comic relief.

[Willapp]

Slight newbie question but how many contractors actually bother with all this extra insurance? I have PI&PL with Hiscox as required by my contract but aside from that, no other cover specific to being a contractor.

I consider myself a fairly sensible chap and have a decent warchest against being out of work, but am always wary of taking out insurance against every possible thing with the likelihood that you'll never need it.

I realize thought that the whole point of insurance is you don't need it until you need it, at which point you wish you had it, but how many people really bother with IR35 cover for example? Has anybody actually claimed on one of these policies that state they'll cover cost of investigation AND fees, and actually got the money?

[malvolio]

Slight newbie question but how many contractors actually bother with all this extra insurance? I have PI&PL with Hiscox as required by my contract but aside from that, no other cover specific to being a contractor.

I consider myself a fairly sensible chap and have a decent warchest against being out of work, but am always wary of taking out insurance against every possible thing with the likelihood that you'll never need it.

I realize thought that the whole point of insurance is you don't need it until you need it, at which point you wish you had it, but how many people really bother with IR35 cover for example? Has anybody actually claimed on one of these policies that state they'll cover cost of investigation AND fees, and actually got the money?

That's really the whole point of IPSE membership. All the necessary - or potentially necessary - cover is in place for £240 a year for IPSE+. You can't get insurance at the point you find you need it, and for such a trivial amount for the breadth of cover it's a no brainer.

Any tax investigation to tribunal level is likely to cost you around £15k in fees and lost earnings and without professional support you will almost certainly lose which will cost you another several thousand. Sure you can live without it?

AS for how many bother - there's 23,000 IPSE members for as start, quite possibly a similar number with QDOS and similar commercial providers and all those guys who use umbreallas for fear of an IR35 investigation. So quite a few...

[TheFaQQer]

Slight newbie question but how many contractors actually bother with all this extra insurance? I have PI&PL with Hiscox as required by my contract but aside from that, no other cover specific to being a contractor.

I consider myself a fairly sensible chap and have a decent warchest against being out of work, but am always wary of taking out insurance against every possible thing with the likelihood that you'll never need it.

I realize thought that the whole point of insurance is you don't need it until you need it, at which point you wish you had it, but how many people really bother with IR35 cover for example? Has anybody actually claimed on one of these policies that state they'll cover cost of investigation AND fees, and actually got the money?

The only IR35 policy that I am aware of that could pay out for investigation, fees and penalties is the TLC35 from Qdos - and they haven't lost one of those cases. It would do their marketing the world of good if they did, because the people that say "oh, they'll never pay out" wouldn't be able to say that any more.

As with everything, though, if you don't think you need the insurance then unless there is a legal reason to have it, then don't have it.

I'm naturally pessimistic, but having seen people get hit with agencies going bust (someone I worked with on this project lost about £40k when her agent disappeared with the money), for the price of a morning's work (which is a valid business expense), it seems daft not to pay it.

[SueEllen]

Slight newbie question but how many contractors actually bother with all this extra insurance? I have PI&PL with Hiscox as required by my contract but aside from that, no other cover specific to being a contractor.

I consider myself a fairly sensible chap and have a decent warchest against being out of work, but am always wary of taking out insurance against every possible thing with the likelihood that you'll never need it.

I realize thought that the whole point of insurance is you don't need it until you need it, at which point you wish you had it, but how many people really bother with IR35 cover for example? Has anybody actually claimed on one of these policies that state they'll cover cost of investigation AND fees, and actually got the money?

I hope you have business use added to your insurance if you have a car. Lots of permies don't need it but all contractors do.

Plus if you work from home make sure your home insurance covers it as some still don't.

[northernladuk]

The only IR35 policy that I am aware of that could pay out for investigation, fees and penalties is the TLC35 from Qdos - and they haven't lost one of those cases. It would do their marketing the world of good if they did, because the people that say "oh, they'll never pay out" wouldn't be able to say that any more.

As with everything, though, if you don't think you need the insurance then unless there is a legal reason to have it, then don't have it.

I'm naturally pessimistic, but having seen people get hit with agencies going bust (someone I worked with on this project lost about £40k when her agent disappeared with the money), for the price of a morning's work (which is a valid business expense), it seems daft not to pay it.

Absolutely this for me. It's so cheap it's a no brainer. Am sure I am throwing a couple of hundred quid away but I have membership AND the TLC35. Am sure someone will come along and tell me I am wasting my money because of the overlap but a) I can't be bothered looking in to the detail and b) I sleep soundly at night so am happy with the situation.

I also haven't taken advantage of the discounts which as been pointed out in the last few days can almost pay for the membership if you are lucky so will definitely be looking at that in the coming weeks.

[northernladuk]

I realize thought that the whole point of insurance is you don't need it until you need it, at which point you wish you had it, but how many people really bother with IR35 cover for example? Has anybody actually claimed on one of these policies that state they'll cover cost of investigation AND fees, and actually got the money?

One thing you have to bear in mind when asking who's been affected is the fact that people that post on these boards are actually making the effort to understand their IR35 situation and mitigate the risk. The people that might actually need this are those that can't be arsed to put any effort in so won't post on here. You might get no responses to your question on here but we aren't the people that are most likely to claim... if that makes sense.

[malvolio]

The only IR35 policy that I am aware of that could pay out for investigation, fees and penalties is the TLC35 from Qdos - and they haven't lost one of those cases. It would do their marketing the world of good if they did, because the people that say "oh, they'll never pay out" wouldn't be able to say that any more.

Abbey do Survive35 which is the same deal at much the same cost.

[TheFaQQer]

I also haven't taken advantage of the discounts which as been pointed out in the last few days can almost pay for the membership if you are lucky so will definitely be looking at that in the coming weeks.

I'd not looked for ages, but there are some quite good ones there if you are going to spend the money anyway. For example, I was out at Pizza Express with my family in the summer. When the bill came, I immediately got a text gift card through IPSE Advantages and got 8% off the meal there and then.

I haven't even been using it that much because I thought "oh they'll be rubbish", but I know I've saved over £100 in the past six months, so my membership has been a lot cheaper this year than in the past.

[TheFaQQer]

Abbey do Survive35 which is the same deal at much the same cost.

As I typed it, I thought "Abbey do something", but I didn't know the cost or details of it.

I didn't join IPSE for the IR35 cover, because I already had Qdos in place - it's the rest of the package that makes sense to me.