Application Frameworks!

[TheMonkey]

Ok this is interesting. I'm going to do some fairly low-level application construction which requires sockets, windows UI, reasonable performance and looks nice.

Can't be bothered to pick a framework so please help me!

I'm getting biased towards C++ / MFC but it's so over-#defined Everything is a fecking macro.

[AtW]

Use browser based front end and C# - this way you can port to other than Windows platforms.

[TheMonkey]

Yeah but the runtime payload is high, it's slow start up, hard to deploy and hard to protect the source of...

Browser UI is NOT an option!

[AtW]

I have created a light weight WebServer with simple templating engine in C# and it works cross platform - very fast and no dependency on ASP.NET or what not, start up instant. I am actually planning to open source it when I get time to tidy up the code.

Also I find WinForms done in .NET is too slow to redraw - I just feel how much slower they are than when build in MFC, really strange that is because I see no reason why they should be that slower.

[TheMonkey]

Also I find WinForms done in .NET is too slow to redraw - I just feel how much slower they are than when build in MFC, really strange that is because I see no reason why they should be that slower.

Very slow. I think it's something to do with the layout engine not even slightly matching the underlying win32 API so there's a lot of calculation going on. It's even worse in .Net 2.0!

Ironically after doing some work with Objective C on MacOS X, I think that winforms really is a pile of poo.

Take a look at this and weep: http://developer.apple.com/documenta...ngs/index.html

No bytecode to be found anywhere.

If only I could do this on a PC.

[AtW]

In VS 2005 it is very slow to redraw forms when running app under debugging mode inside IDE itself - joke slow IMO, think they are addressing it in Service Pack and they'd better do because it is embarassingly slow.

Macs are irrelevant - they may be nice, but targeting them exclusively is commercial suicide.

[TheMonkey]

Macs are irrelevant - they may be nice, but targeting them exclusively is commercial suicide.

I agree - unfortunately their entire solution is somewhat better engineered as Apple had a chance to throw away many years of legacy crap and build something fantastic from the ground up.

To quote myself: "All technology and knowledge is irrelevant in time".

[Cowboy Bob]

If you're going to use Java, for the love of God don't use Swing. I'm a Java pro, but I'd never recommend that heap of crap. At least use one of the more optimal frameworks out there such as SWT

[TheOmegaMan]

Nah Swing is fine and pure Java. Perhaps you don't know what you are doing. Trust me I have been doing this sh*t for 10+ years now.

[Cowboy Bob]

Nah Swing is fine and pure Java. Perhaps you don't know what you are doing. Trust me I have been doing this sh*t for 10+ years now.

I've been doing this sh!t for 10 years too - used to do AWT before Swing as well. The biggest problem with Swing (apart from being on the slow side) is that it doesn't integrate very well into the platform look and feel. I know this is fixed in Java 6, but that's still in beta. SWT is a much nicer framework in general - even if it isn't pure Java.