Unpaid final invoice by client (working through agency & umbrella)

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Thanks for the DueDil tip - the end client seems to be doing alright, with £2.7m / £3.4m assets and cash.

I opted out of the regulations, but only after being interviewed by the client and having been offered the contract. Think I read that for the opt out to be valid it must be done before being introduced to the client - is that right?

Assuming the opt out is not valid and since I'm employed by the umbrella, is there anything I can do to make the agency pay the umbrella? I suppose last resort would be tribunal since the amount owed is reasonably large.

Thanks again for your help here.

Edit: one last thing - is what the umbrella company are suggesting, that I would be owed no more than minimum wage once they'd paid that (even if they receive funds from the client/agency), legal?

You are right about the opt-out so you could put this in writing to the agency requesting that they pay you as per their obligations under the Conduct Regs.

The umbrella company - under the terms of an over-arching contract (which they should have in place) - is obliged to pay you a regular salary whether or not they receive payment of their invoices from the agency or client; this payment is usually at minimum wage or living wage. Once they then receive payment for their invoice they will pay you a profit related bonus. So, to answer your question, if they receive payment from the agency they should pay you the balance of the invoice after they've made the minimum wage payment

[boggled]

You could have a look at the financial health of the end client (DueDil is a really good site for this) - that will give you an idea as to whether or not the debt is worth pursuing. Did you opt-out or opt-in of the Conduct of Employment Agencies and Employment Business Regulations? If you opted in the the agency is obliged to pay you regardless of whether or not they've been paid by the end client. If the client is solvent and you've opted out then the only other course of action open to you is to look at an employment tribunal - you would cite the umbrella company, the agency and the end client and then a Judge would sort it all out. However, there are costs attached to this now so it may only be a viable option if the amount owed is reasonably large

Thanks for the DueDil tip - the end client seems to be doing alright, with £2.7m / £3.4m assets and cash.

I opted out of the regulations, but only after being interviewed by the client and having been offered the contract. Think I read that for the opt out to be valid it must be done before being introduced to the client - is that right?

Assuming the opt out is not valid and since I'm employed by the umbrella, is there anything I can do to make the agency pay the umbrella? I suppose last resort would be tribunal since the amount owed is reasonably large.

Thanks again for your help here.

Edit: one last thing - is what the umbrella company are suggesting, that I would be owed no more than minimum wage once they'd paid that (even if they receive funds from the client/agency), legal?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

The umbrella have chased the agency, who have chased the client - but to no end. I'm really not sure what my next steps should be.

You could have a look at the financial health of the end client (DueDil is a really good site for this) - that will give you an idea as to whether or not the debt is worth pursuing. Did you opt-out or opt-in of the Conduct of Employment Agencies and Employment Business Regulations? If you opted in the the agency is obliged to pay you regardless of whether or not they've been paid by the end client. If the client is solvent and you've opted out then the only other course of action open to you is to look at an employment tribunal - you would cite the umbrella company, the agency and the end client and then a Judge would sort it all out. However, there are costs attached to this now so it may only be a viable option if the amount owed is reasonably large

[boggled]

If your timesheet has been approved by the end client and you have evidence of it then there is no reason for non-payment (as they cannot say that they were not satisfied with your work etc.) unless there are cash flow issues and it's a case of can't pay rather than won't pay. As there is a contractual chain here you will need to ask your employer (the brolly) to chase their customer (the agency) who should then be chasing their customer (the client). If that doesn't work you have the option to use an Employment Tribunal to resolve the situation

The umbrella have chased the agency, who have chased the client - but to no end. I'm really not sure what my next steps should be.

[boggled]

Thank you all for the helpful and encouraging responses, and sorry for not coming back here sooner.

The reason the agency hasn't paid the umbrella is because they haven't been paid by the client - I'm not sure why, but they are a fairly large company and it wouldn't seem to be down to cashflow issues.

My latest correspondence from the umbrella stated that once they had made a minimum wage payment, they would make no further payments - regardless of whether they received payment from the agency. Is that legal?

Since I was introduced to the client a day before opting out of regulations with the agency and umbrella, it seems that regulations apply - but my contracted rate with the umbrella is only minimum wage. Can anyone suggest how might I file a tribunal for the full amount?

[TheFaQQer]

Why would a contractor that's using an Umbrella company buy an insurance package off the IPSE snake oil vendors insurance membership machine?

Because umbrella users get called up for jury duty. Or get sick. Or die. Or they want access to a cheap pension scheme. Or cheap private medical insurance.

Or they recognise that umbrella company users are under attack for travel and subsistence expenses, and want someone to try to stop it happening.

Why wouldn't any of those issues affect an umbrella user?

[TykeMerc]

Why would a contractor that's using an Umbrella company buy an insurance package off the IPSE snake oil vendors insurance membership machine? There's nothing much in there that vaguely applies to an Umbrella although I'm sure someone will correct that view.
In truth you would have to check the insurance docs carefully to see if a claim would even be possible as an Employee, then there's the fun of proof which could be tricky. Hell he hasn't said he's got any evidence of the Umbrella chasing the Agent for payment.

[FarmerPalmer]

Now, if you were an IPSE member, you wouldn't be worried, agency default insurance is covered by the membership:

https://www.ipse.co.uk/advice/insura...lure-insurance

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

If your timesheet has been approved by the end client and you have evidence of it then there is no reason for non-payment (as they cannot say that they were not satisfied with your work etc.) unless there are cash flow issues and it's a case of can't pay rather than won't pay. As there is a contractual chain here you will need to ask your employer (the brolly) to chase their customer (the agency) who should then be chasing their customer (the client). If that doesn't work you have the option to use an Employment Tribunal to resolve the situation

[TheFaQQer]

Both contracts (with the agency and umbrella) include an opt out clause surrounding employment regulations, but since I was introduced to the client the day before signing either, am I correct in assuming these don't apply?

If the opt out was done correctly, then you wouldn't be able to rely on it. However, I doubt that it was done properly - by both you and the umbrella company, in writing, before being introduced to the client. If you are inside the regulations, then the agency must pay the umbrella - whether they get paid or not.

My main question is, since I'm employed by the umbrella - do I have any grounds to file a claim against the agency to ensure that I get the full day rate, or will I have to accept minimum wage from the umbrella?

You can't chase the agency - you have no contract with them. You could ask the client if they have paid the agency, but again you can't force them to pay because you are the employee at the end of the chain.

Also, if the umbrella does go ahead and pay minimum wage, would they still have to pass on the remaining payment if it was eventually received by the client or would that be my lot?

If the umbrella get the money and don't pay you (and they are contracted to pay you) then that would count as theft so you could not only sue them for the money but they could be prosecuted as well.

You need to find out whether the client has paid the agency. If they have, then the umbrella needs to chase the agency. If they haven't then the agency needs to chase the client.

[NotAllThere]

The client owes the agency money
The agency owes the umbrella company money
The umbrella company owes you minimum wage.

You do not have a contract with the agency. You have no business relationship at all with the agency. You cannot chase the agency for the money, anymore than you could chase the client for the money. The only entity that can chase the agency for the money is your employer, the brolly.

You must push the brolly to chase the debt with the agency. This is your only route, so far as I can see (IANAL).

[TykeMerc]

The tricky bits in this situation are that you don't know the truth of the matter (who's paid who and how much), plus literally speaking it's the Umbrella that's owed the money, you are their employee so you chasing the Agent could arguably be a bit of a dead end.

[jmo21]

So the agent say they've paid up everything?

[boggled]

Hi all,

First post here, I'm having trouble getting paid my final invoice so any similar experience or tips would be most welcome.

I was put in touch with the client by an agency and then went through an umbrella company for the contract. My final timesheet was approved over two months ago but the client has not paid the agency, who pay the umbrella, who pay me.

My initial agreement was with the agency at a decent day rate, but now the umbrella is pointing to terms in our agreement that state they will only pay in line with the minimum wage if payment is not received from the client/agency.

Both contracts (with the agency and umbrella) include an opt out clause surrounding employment regulations, but since I was introduced to the client the day before signing either, am I correct in assuming these don't apply?

My main question is, since I'm employed by the umbrella - do I have any grounds to file a claim against the agency to ensure that I get the full day rate, or will I have to accept minimum wage from the umbrella?

Also, if the umbrella does go ahead and pay minimum wage, would they still have to pass on the remaining payment if it was eventually received by the client or would that be my lot?

It's been a real pain trying to communicate with the agency and umbrella who just point me to one another.