Zen and the art of SQL

[Clever Hans]

Bingo!...this book shows you how to make music with them.

No. I have that book (Art of SQL), and it is more to do with practical implementation and efficiency, so more like setting your speakers up.

It is quite useful and interesting, but not what you originally asked for (thinking in SQL), though it has a chapter or so on that sort of thing.

Celko's "SQL Puzzles & Answers" (which I mentioned and also have) is aimed at solving real world problems, and provides multiple drafts of the solution attempts so you can see the thinking along the way.

I don't have his SQL for Smarties, which I believe is for pushing your SQL thinking to advanced level.

The Cookbook is good though, and if you or anyone reading this has an MSSQL focus, look at the T-SQL cookbook which influenced it, and the MS Press Inside T-SQL series.

[Twilkes]

Your question is strikingly similar to some of the reviews here Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: The Art of SQL

Bingo, that's exactly it. Between the Cookbook and this that should sort me out - it's like the Cookbook shows you all the scales and chords, and this book shows you how to make music with them.

Cheers,

Tony

[lightng]

SQL Cookbook

[Clever Hans]

Joe Celko is probably the best known author for that sort of stuff.

eg.
SQL for Smarties
SQL Puzzles

These books are pretty much along the lines asked for.

[Alceste]

Hi there,

I know SQL isn’t up there with the money-earning IT skills, but can anyone recommend any books/websites that actually teach how to THINK in SQL, rather than just explaining what the commands do and giving a few examples?

Tony

Your question is strikingly similar to some of the reviews here Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: The Art of SQL

[Twilkes]

try this book:
Inside Relational Databases with Examples in Access eBook: Mark Whitehorn, Bill Marklyn: Amazon.co.uk: Books

and this artiicle:
SQL and the JOIN Operator - SQLServerCentral
(will need registration)

Next time you want help on a subject, try not to insult those who are best in a position to help you, it just makes you look like an ungrateful idiot

Thanks for the suggestions, that's what I was looking for. And I wasn't sure that I had insulted anyone, certainly not intentionally. I just wanted to clarify what I was looking for because the first few posts were focussing on other things, i.e. I have no idea what version of SQL I'm going to be using, and the cheapo-ness or otherwise of SQL contracting wasn't really the issue.

Ta,

Tony

[d000hg]

To 'think' in code, it helps to know how computers work a bit - assembly and bits and bytes and so on. To 'think' in SQL, I think knowing the basics of how an RDBS works - it involves specific bits of computer science.
Trying to write SQL as a programmer means you mightn't be very efficient. PL/SQL for instance I really like because it's like 'real' programming... but that means I can abuse it to break Oracle's parallelism and end up with slow, procedural stuff rather than smart queries operating on datasets.

[Spacecadet]

Because there is no 'it', I'm just trying to improve my skills. By not-high-earning I meant if someone went into an agency and said 'I know SQL', the agent would probably say 'Great, so do I, what else can you do?' It's not that valuable on its own without other tech or e.g. analyst skills.

If you had a non-IT colleague who knew a bit of SQL but wanted to get up to speed, what would you tell them to do? [/feedline for insults]

Tony

try this book:
Inside Relational Databases with Examples in Access eBook: Mark Whitehorn, Bill Marklyn: Amazon.co.uk: Books

and this artiicle:
SQL and the JOIN Operator - SQLServerCentral
(will need registration)

Next time you want help on a subject, try not to insult those who are best in a position to help you, it just makes you look like an ungrateful idiot

[Jubber]

If you had a non-IT colleague who knew a bit of SQL but wanted to get up to speed, what would you tell them to do?

Get an Access database which holds some complex queries (or build your own), open them in SQL view, make a note of what's happening. Try to recreate the queries in SQL (GUI not allowed). Buy a book. Buy SQL SERVER developer edition (quite cheap).

[Twilkes]

If its such a low cost resource then why don't you simply hire a cheapo SQL contractor to do it for you

Because there is no 'it', I'm just trying to improve my skills. By not-high-earning I meant if someone went into an agency and said 'I know SQL', the agent would probably say 'Great, so do I, what else can you do?' It's not that valuable on its own without other tech or e.g. analyst skills.

If you had a non-IT colleague who knew a bit of SQL but wanted to get up to speed, what would you tell them to do? [/feedline for insults]

Tony

[Spacecadet]

I know SQL isn’t up there with the money-earning IT skills

If its such a low cost resource then why don't you simply hire a cheapo SQL contractor to do it for you

[MarillionFan]

Hi there,

I know SQL isn’t up there with the money-earning IT skills, but can anyone recommend any books/websites that actually teach how to THINK in SQL, rather than just explaining what the commands do and giving a few examples? I know my way around the SQL functions, but can still struggle working out exactly what has to be joined to what and when and with what conditions, e.g. always seem to get tied in knots when any table needs joining to itself, and end up with a query that looks twice as long as it needs to be. Is it just experience, or are there some decent tutorials/practice sites out there?

By the way, I’ve been reading CUK in conjunction with HousePriceCrash.co.uk, and don’t think I’ve ever had a more, shall we say, ‘grounded’ view of the world. Thank you.

Tony

Not sure that it's not up there with money earning skills.

Like anything you can have a basic understanding of a language. I can write 'Hello World' programs in lots of languages, but doesn't give me an appreciation to develop a product.

SQL is the same. T-SQL or PL-SQL expertise as a developer pays well, as does database administration. Just depends on your level of expertise.

[RichardCranium]

Which implementation of SQL?

Different SQL engines parse and process the language in different ways. So besides there being different dialects of SQL, you also need to be aware of how the engine joins tables and the sequence it processes conditions and a bunch of other stuff I've managed to forget.

[Twilkes]

Hi there,

I know SQL isn’t up there with the money-earning IT skills, but can anyone recommend any books/websites that actually teach how to THINK in SQL, rather than just explaining what the commands do and giving a few examples? I know my way around the SQL functions, but can still struggle working out exactly what has to be joined to what and when and with what conditions, e.g. always seem to get tied in knots when any table needs joining to itself, and end up with a query that looks twice as long as it needs to be. Is it just experience, or are there some decent tutorials/practice sites out there?

By the way, I’ve been reading CUK in conjunction with HousePriceCrash.co.uk, and don’t think I’ve ever had a more, shall we say, ‘grounded’ view of the world. Thank you.

Tony