Reply to: Speeding

[threaded]

Just spotted another misconception: "an insurance company is one entity", it almost certainly isn't. Generally the people who sell you insurance are from one company, renewals might be another, the people who actually provide the insurance are another, and the company that deals with your claims is another still. Just like us, all contractors really, just dressed up with a few more staff. They may even all be sat in the same building and if you ask any individual employee, they'll say they work for insurance company X, but that is what they are ordered to say. Who you think you are insured with is actually a company that just handles contracts with all these other companies and will only employ a few hundred people at best.

When it comes to claims handling IIRC there are only 3 real companies that all the insurance companies use, and #1 has like 75% of the market. So sometimes people are a little surprised when they claim to find that their insurers know of previous accidents (that they failed to mention), well simple really, it is the same company who handled that claim that is handling this claim, duh!

And why didn't the insurers know when you bought the insurance? Well, passing that kind of information from claims to sales is not part of these companies contracts.

HTH

[threaded]

All very well and good, but having worked for several insurance underwriters etc. etc. I know that all this crap about actuarials is just that, absolute crap. Actuarials only give a minimum price for the insurance, the price for insurance is set like anything else: by the sales dept. and the market.

For example, everyone knows that women get cheaper insurance, everyone also knows women are generally crap drivers and have lots of accidents. So why do they get cheaper insurance? Simple if you have a little knowledge of what actually happens: essentially women generally have more free time or more ability at work to call around different brokers and get the lowest price. Many firms worked this out so they actually set up or spun off special units to deal just with women only policies and call centres set up to respond best to women.

HTH

[oraclesmith]

....which means that (taking us right back to the original question) that it would be better to declare your points when asked because little indiscretions always seem to catch up with you. Well they do with me anyhow !

[ASB]

You're missing the point.

Correct I was. I hadn't realised that you meant the non disclosure was cleared up before issue of policy. Doh.

[oraclesmith]

You're missing the point.

If you inadvertently forget to mention something at application time and then the insurer finds it out BEFORE the policy is finally agreed, they are running an increased risk if they agree the policy. Eg.

You: "Hello I'd like some insurance"

Telesales "What car have you got...... blah blah blah"
......

Telesales: "OK have you any medical conditions that would affect your driving ability"

You "Don't think so"

Telesales "It says here you have epilepsy"

You "Ah yeah I forgot about that"

Telesales "I'll need to talk to my supervisor"
.....
Telesales "I'm afraid we'll have to consult with the underwriters, we'll call you back"

etc.

If they do THEN give you the policy then they are running the risk that you are holding back other relevant information which they might not EVER find out about, but which would materially increase the risk of you having an accident or having your car stolen etc. ie. more risk than with someone who appears to be totally honest with them. They can always refuse the policy but the non-disclosure clause on a claim only works if the insurer finds out something you didn't tell them, AFTER the policy is agreed. It won't work if they never find out.

[ASB]

The point is that they think you've lied. You may not have done so deliberately, but they can't tell that. They know you've lied because they have the information to hand to compare and they know you didn't disclose something which you should have.

Ergo... if you've lied about something on your application, you have probably lied about all sorts of things - things they don't know about... eg. mods to the vehicle, medical conditions, business use, .

They can only claim non-disclosure if those things subsequently come to light. They may not. They may have been unknowingly insuring a driver with, say, mental illness, which may not necessarily come to light at claim time, or ever.

Which is why there is an increased risk of insuring someone who lied to them.

It doesn't work that way. They don't need any other non disclosure to come to light. The fact that there is any non disclosure at all gives them the power to void it in the event of any claim.

[Fleetwood]

I bought a previous write off many years ago, I had no idea until some little scroat stole the car and crashed it, the insurance company refused to pay as they had run the number plate through their computer and it had come up as 'previously righten off' I just argued that they had the reg when they took my money so that was their problem, to my suprise they payed up!

I bought a previous write-off many years ago. I had no idea until some little scroat stole the car and crashed it. The insurance company refused to pay, as they had run the number plate through their computer and it had come up as 'previously written off'. I just argued that they had the reg when they took my money so that was their problem. To my surprise they paid up!
hth

[gingerjedi]

I bought a previous write off many years ago, I had no idea until some little scroat stole the car and crashed it, the insurance company refused to pay as they had run the number plate through their computer and it had come up as 'previously righten off' I just argued that they had the reg when they took my money so that was their problem, to my suprise they payed up!

[Asterix]

Non-disclosure

Doesn't it work both ways ? Hence if they already know stuff about someone, should they disclose it to him ? What happened to the Data Protection Act ? I know DVLA has sold its database many times over but is there someone that oversees what goes on ?

[oraclesmith]

The point is that they think you've lied. You may not have done so deliberately, but they can't tell that. They know you've lied because they have the information to hand to compare and they know you didn't disclose something which you should have.

Ergo... if you've lied about something on your application, you have probably lied about all sorts of things - things they don't know about... eg. mods to the vehicle, medical conditions, business use, .

They can only claim non-disclosure if those things subsequently come to light. They may not. They may have been unknowingly insuring a driver with, say, mental illness, which may not necessarily come to light at claim time, or ever.

Which is why there is an increased risk of insuring someone who lied to them.

[ASB]

You're right there. A friend of mine made his insurance company very nervous when they found out about something that he genuinely forgot to tell them about. It puts the potential risk up for them.

I don't see how it puts the risk up for the insurers. It just makes their standard response "material non disclosure now sod off".

[oraclesmith]

You're right there. A friend of mine made his insurance company very nervous when they found out about something that he genuinely forgot to tell them about. It puts the potential risk up for them.

[wobbegong]

In any case, my car insurance is to be renewed soon and I am not sure what I should tell them (if anything). Sometimes the question is : "Do you have endorsements on your license" , in this case the answer is no. Other times, "do you have any convictions", then the answer is yes.. If I reply yes, they ask me to put the code of the conviction as it shows on my license, but there is nothing there ....

When I renewed last year, my insurers already knew about my endorsements! Maybe they ask you just to see if you're the upstanding, honest type, and if not, then "adjust" the premiums accordingly?

[malandri]

PS why is this in light relief?

Apologies . I should have put it in General... I realised it too late

[VectraMan]

Licence.

I've always been asked about "convictions".