Reply to: Releasing loans before the settlement is finalised

[webberg]

Has anybody had success with writing loans off ?
Does the settlement payment need to complete before loan write-off can happen?

Q1, yes.

Q2. I've said many times before and again now.

A loan write off is taxable courtesy of section 554C(10(ab).

There are some complex rules about the value of the write off where the "same" amount has been previously taxed.

Clearly if the "same" amount has not been taxed before there is no mitigation.

If the "same" amount is from a year before the write off (logically inevitable) but the tax is not settled until AFTER the write off, is there a set off to ensure tax is paid only once?

I think there is a real danger that the answer is "no" and that you might pay tax twice.

Therefore unles you have settled and have it in writing that there is no further tax charge, DO NOT have a loan written off until you have that assurance.

[Dave19]

Has anybody had success with writing loans off ?
Does the settlement payment need to complete before loan write-off can happen?

[jbryce]

Sigh - I've had my run-ins with Saleos in the past - I'm still waiting for the solicitor's letter.

You could argue the toss that he's making money from other people's misery, you could observe that he's not massively collegiate in his attitude to others fighting the same battles and you could definitely say that he's not a particularly pleasant individual.

But. He's still around - which is more than be said for a lot of the feckless f***ers who profited from the schemes back in the day.

[Invisiblehand]

I don’t hide my historic involvement with Penfolds

Then why did you write

"Below is a defamatory load of BS.

I’m a qualified CTA and have been for over 15 years.

I didn’t sell a single contractor a scheme. I don’t offer any scheme, of any variety, now and haven’t done so for several years and there is no such thing as a GAAR proof scheme".

[Saleos]

Just to be clear though Penfolfds/Hamilton were run by the same crowd as K2 whose loans are now with FS Capital? I may be wrong - Correct me if I’m wrong.

You’re wrong. Those who introduced clients to K2/Hyrax were one of more than half a dozen who did so to Penfolds. They had absolutely nothing to do with running it.

I don’t hide my historic involvement with Penfolds (I had none with Hamilton which was designed by Kingston Smith). As all of my clients know. It’s in the public domain. Absolutely sure no one has done more, for longer, defending such schemes.

[DavidD]

Just to be clear though Penfolfds/Hamilton were run by the same crowd as K2 whose loans are now with FS Capital? I may be wrong - Correct me if I’m wrong.

[Invisiblehand]

He used to be an introducer to schemes. He popped up to prevent his scheme from being lumped in with the others.

But denies it whenever someone brings it up.

[cojak]

So a promoter then?

He used to be an introducer to schemes. He popped up to prevent his scheme from being lumped in with the others.

Loans were made by an EBT so the existence or otherwise of the former employer is irrelevant. As is all reference to FS Capital or Pinotage. Neither have absolutely anything to do with Penfolds or Hamilton. No one is recalling those loans. Complete scaremongering nonesence.

[NeedTheSunshine]

Vested interest in that I have been defending them for 6 1/2 years, having JR's still preventing APNs being enforced for my clients and litigated the Hoey case in the FTT in July which has been appealed and will proceed to the UT along with our Loan Charge JR.

So a promoter then?

[plopyyboom]

______________

His point is you mentioned Penfolds/Hamilton Trust in your original post and these Schemes/Trusts are absolutely not emailing beneficiaries regarding loan recalls - the email you received relates to different schemes / trusts so you should remove the reference to Penfolds / Hamilton Trust in your post as it just causes unnecessary confusion.

No probs, removed that, apologies for the confusion.
As above poster and as per the original message, I am concerned about the IHT charge implications.

[Forsythia]

Question: Presumably tax position is the same whether the loan to Pinotage Trustees is written off now or after settlement? Both will attract the same IHT (if due)????? Because I too am in the middle of settlement and will never have time to settle prior to loans being written off.

[Forsythia]

______________

His point is you mentioned Penfolds/Hamilton Trust in your original post and these Schemes/Trusts are absolutely not emailing beneficiaries regarding loan recalls - the email you received relates to different schemes / trusts so you should remove the reference to Penfolds / Hamilton Trust in your post as it just causes unnecessary confusion.

Yep. Agree. I am also with Penfolds/Hamiltons and can absolutely say for sure that they are NOT calling in loans, or have passed loans to FS Capital.

[Forsythia]

What do you mean by scare/mislead as I am now utterly confused by your comments. I am merely stating facts of what I have received and what appears to be happening.
Am I to ignore these emails altogether? This is an excerpt from the email received from pintagetrustees.ch:

Don't ignore them. In same boat with Pinotage myself. Received the terrifying letter and spoke to them. Speak to them at their
lawyers on 01534 786705. No, this is not a scam. They will charge you legal costs to write off the loan, that is all. I suspect that the
FS Capital letters was to put a stick of dynamite up people's backsides to contact them. Apparently people were just not communicating and they want the trusts wound up by 31st December.

[wilks]

What do you mean by scare/mislead as I am now utterly confused by your comments. I am merely stating facts of what I have received and what appears to be happening.
Am I to ignore these emails altogether? This is an excerpt from the email received from pintagetrustees.ch:

______________

His point is you mentioned Penfolds/Hamilton Trust in your original post and these Schemes/Trusts are absolutely not emailing beneficiaries regarding loan recalls - the email you received relates to different schemes / trusts so you should remove the reference to Penfolds / Hamilton Trust in your post as it just causes unnecessary confusion.

[plopyyboom]

The trustees of the above arrangements are categorically NOT recalling loans. Pinotage, who purport to have sold the right to repayment of some loans to FS Capital are not, never have been and never will be trustees of Penfolds or Hamilton. Please delete your post before you mislead, and scare, others.

Thank you.

What do you mean by scare/mislead as I am now utterly confused by your comments. I am merely stating facts of what I have received and what appears to be happening.
Am I to ignore these emails altogether? This is an excerpt from the email received from pintagetrustees.ch:

Should it not be possible to release/write off these unassigned loans by 13 December 2019 then the trustee is obliged to assign them so that the three trusts can be closed by 31 December 2019.

Formal Notice of Assignment of Loans

As required by law, we write to formally notify you that on 30th October 2019, Pinotage (PTC) Limited of Folio Chambers P.O. Box 800, Road Town, Tortola British Virgin Islands in its capacity as trustee of The Contractor Solutions Employer-Financed Retirement Benefit Scheme 2012 (established by an instrument of settlement dated on or around 28th March 2012), The Prime Contractor Solutions Employer-Financed Retirement Benefit Scheme (previously known as The K2 Contractor Solutions Employment-Financed Retirement Benefit Scheme (established by an instrument of settlement dated on or around 25th November 2011) and The Hyrax Resourcing Employer-Financed Retirement Benefit Scheme (established by an instrument of settlement dated on or around 5th March 2014) assigned for value to FS Capital Limited (see details below) absolutely all and any title, rights and interest it has under the terms of your loans and any loan agreements you made with the trustee or other party the benefit of which were transferred beneficially to the trustee.

Following the assignment, FS Capital Limited has been in contact to confirm that the loans are now due and payable under the terms of the loan agreements and interest will accrue, as detailed in that agreement, on all outstanding balances.

FS Capital Limited contact details

1 St Paul’s Square Birmingham B3 1QU
T: 0330 124 2629
E: [email protected]